| Username |
Post |
| khaja biscuit |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 05:59 PM
A Friend in India to All the World
By KEITH BRADSHER
PUTTAPARTHY, India — The president of India, who is best known for overseeing India's nuclear tests in 1998, recently paid a state visit to the country's largest ashram, to meet and receive the blessings of a holy man who preaches nonviolence.
The visit underlined the appeal of the unusual holy man, Sri Sathya Sai Baba, who draws presidents, prime ministers and other leaders not only from India but also from outside it; altogether he claims followers in 178 countries.
The separation between state and religion in India, clear and bright in the years immediately after Indian independence in 1947, has grown less distinct. That is especially true with the political ascendancy of the governing Bharatiya Janata Party, which emphasizes Hindu nationalism.
Part of the appeal of the Baba, as he is called by followers and others here, is that ever since the 1940's he has been preaching an unusual mixture of faiths and encouraging religious tolerance.
Official visits here have become one of the odder features of Indian public life, and among the most colorful. The Baba's mixture of religions extends far beyond traditional Hindu beliefs, and that lets him attract politicians of various faiths, including Muslims like President A. P. J. Abdul Kalam of India.
President Kalam, a former nuclear scientist, flew to the ashram's private airport here in southern India on a blue-and-white air force jet. Saluted by olive-clad police officers, he climbed into the lead car of a motorcade, and Sikh military aides in scarlet turbans followed suit.
Lining the road to the ashram were stone tablets inscribed with the swami's utterances. "Money comes and money goes/Morality comes and grows," read one sign in English, signed simply Baba, meaning divine father.
On a hillside at the ashram's entrance stood enormous, brightly painted statues of Jesus, Buddha and Hanuman, an Indian monkey god. Farther on was a large Chinese temple and a big billboard of a benevolently smiling Baba, his hand raised in blessing.
Two-story modern buildings in fuchsia lined the paved avenue, incongruously interspersed with 30-foot-tall statues of acoustic guitars and wooden drums. The clunky Indian-made Ambassador cars chugged past them and pulled to a halt in front of the great hall of the ashram.
More than 10,000 closely packed acolytes sat cross-legged on the floor, the women in saris of brilliant emerald, ruby and indigo silk, the men in white short-sleeve shirts and white trousers, symbolizing purity.
President Kalam deferentially slipped off his brown loafers and walked in stocking feet to the front of the hall, followed by a small entourage, whose members had also tucked their shoes under flowering bushes outside. The Baba, 76, a short man with a thick mane of black hair, shuffled forward in his robe.
Acolytes discreetly angled for the Baba's notice; one of the few Westerners nearby, a middle-aged man also sitting cross-legged, clapped his hand to his heart and wobbled visibly with emotion when the Baba appeared to wave in his direction.
Famous for seldom saying much in public even to his followers, the Baba silently greeted President Kalam. The two men disappeared through polished wood doors decorated with reliefs of Hindu gods and into the Baba's inner sanctum, where they remained a quarter of an hour while the crowd waited quietly.
A senior aide to the Baba whispered that the spiritual leader's full name, Sri Sathya Sai Baba, signified holy, truth, divine mother and divine father.
Preaching the five principles of truth, peace, love, nonviolence and right conduct, the Baba "represents unity of religion, all religions," not just Hinduism, the aide said.
The president emerged and led his entourage out of the great hall, putting on his shoes and hopping back in a car for a short drive to the ashram's guesthouse. In a brief interview there, he said he had discussed with the swami how to achieve an educational system that combined values with science.
"When they are fused, you get an enlightened citizen," said President Kalam, whose role is mostly ceremonial in this parliamentary democracy; the Parliament elected him in July.
Coming from a Muslim background, the president is a rarity among national politicians in a country that is four-fifths Hindu. He has long contended that India's nuclear weapons program is necessary to keep the peace in the region, and he does not represent warlike intentions.
N. Chandrababu Naidu, the chief minister, or governor, of the Indian state of Andhra Pradesh here, said the Baba was not just a holy man but a public policy expert. Mr. Naidu described repeatedly seeking the swami's advice while turning Hyderabad, the state capital of Andhra Pradesh, into a high-tech center where American companies like Microsoft and Oracle now employ thousands of computer programmers.
Using donations from around the world, the Baba has built two hospitals near here that provide free care to the poor. He is now spending $50 million to build systems for drinking water and irrigation, Mr. Naidu said.
But for all the swami's interest in technology, he refuses to use e-mail, or even pick up a telephone. "He won't correspond with anybody, he won't use phones either," the chief minister said with a faint hint of irritation. "Everyone has to come here."
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| bhedo |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 06:04 PM
Sai Baba is a quack. A guy once asked him to disgorge cucumber out of his mouth. He couldn't do it. If he can spew out hira-moti when he's with influential people, he should also be able to expel cucumbers out of his mouth, if he truly is a godman.
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| Montou |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:01 PM
Interesting!
Heard about him before but never got to know about him more. But its hard to believe that people think him to be God. Personally I dont believe that there can be such a God at present time. So any of you have personally visited him or know sb who has visited him?
For me there is only one God and that is Jesus Christ.
By His Grace,
Montou
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| ruck |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:09 PM
Bhagawan Baba !! Om Sai Ram!!! You are the only truth in the world today....
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| bideshi |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:28 PM
Bhedo,If u don't believe in saibabaji,it's ok.But don't call him any bad names.There r lot s and lots of people who respect him and follow him and worship him.And so,please respect their feelings!
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| suman r dhakal |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:34 PM
he should disgorge cucumber everytime someones asks him too? no one is asking anyone to accepet him as god. but i can say this for sure that he has certainly done more than you and i ever could. built schools and hospitals and much more. if there was no truth in his teachings then do you think people from all over the world would follow him. from doctors to physsists to catholic priests? i have had the opportunity to meet students that have graduated from sai school that work here at honeywell and are graduate students here at the university of arizona. when you meet them and listen to the things they learned at sai school then you know that there is some turth in him. if not god, then one can simply admire and appriciate his life long dedication for the betterment of human conditions in india and all around the world. and if one calls him god beacuse he or she gets satifactiona and finds peace within himself by his teachings then thats wonderful.
if we are ready to pray to idal shiva linga then why not appricate a man who has done much more than a idally sitting shiva linga or other bhagwan ko murti for that matter. and i would be saying the samething if it were someone other than sai baba who had done same for the world. wasn't buddha a simple man?
love all, serve all
suman
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| bhedo |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:45 PM
What about you bideshi? Do you believe in him? Following him as a philosopher is one thing, but worshipping him like he's some sort of an Avatar or godman is another. If you wanna believe in God, go ahead, I'm not gonna try to change your mind. I have a sister in law who is a big devotee of Sai Baba. My whole family makes fun of her for being so gullible. She has even bought "Sai Baba" toys for her young daughter. That's laughable.
But please check the following webpage.Don't know if the allegations are true or not
http://www.sathyasaivictims.com/
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| kewl |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:46 PM
Mr Bhedo your comments is simply like your name ..
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| bhedo |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:49 PM
Thank you kewl, you are so kewl. Check the site.
http://www.sathyasaivictims.com/
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| bhedo |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:54 PM
If I ever get a chance to meet him, I'll ask him to expel rabbit out of his mouth. Man, that would be comical.
-----------> 100% a Hindu. But it doesn't mean I have to follow every godmen and godwomen.
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| kewl |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 09:58 PM
We Nepalese are so "Mahir" in pointing out negative points only. Mr Bhedo why dont you spend your energy to find few positive things he have done too. And by the way, if you dont believe him, simply dont believe. Neither SaiBaba nor his followers are forcing you to do so. But dont you find it amazing how a simple guy have changed that place called PUTTAPARTHY. Free heart surgey are done there for poor people, universities are there. Believing someone as GOD is personal matter. What is the description of GOD ? For me GOD does not mean someone with five hands and wear jewels. I believe SaiBaba as God because he have done socail works that is unimaginable to be done by individuals. He's different from me. So I consider him my "GOD", my Guru.
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| nhuchche |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 10:04 PM
Check out the archive on the same topic
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 10:21 PM
Satya Sai Baba
Has been my inspiration, and my mentor for a long time.... And I carry him in my heart!
Bhedo ji...
Amazingly, I credit you with more intelligence than that! Ke garne hajur, I also give you the benefit of doubt! :)
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| trikal |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 10:45 PM
.. BhedoJi,
Please let me know If anything "bad" or good happens to you .....I think something is gonna happen to you............If good happens ...that's ok.....If bad happens I might have the solution.........
TRIKAL..........
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| nuts |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 11:01 PM
Just read all the posts in the archive. One of the most healthiest discussions ever here on sajha!!
any possibility for it's continuity ?
Thanks for posting the archive, Nhuchche.
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| krishna |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 11:07 PM
hahahaha...trikal jyu..you the man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
kasto hasaunu bhako hare shiva....atti ta garnu bhayena ni...pet michi michi haseko ta mechai bata jhandai khutrukkai tala bajarriyeko....
achamma lagcha kahile kahi ta malai... j bhayepani solution cha ma sanga bhannu hunchha?? sai baba bhanda ta malai tapain ko biswas lagna thalyo ta trikal jyu....
sarai majako manche tapain...tapainlai ek din bhetera majjale basera tapainle bhane jatti ko cheez haru lyaera dina man lagi racha trikal jyu??
sarai khusi banaunu bho malai aaja...
tapain ko priya,
krishnakanahiya....
by the way bhedo..i think you have got some point....i checked that website, it certainly got some mind boggling information about sai baba frauding people...
all the sai baba followers, you've got to watch that video..i am sure its going to change your views towards sai baba if you do....there is certainly some valid points and truth behind it....i was definitely taken into surprise when the truth was revealed....
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| Trikal |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 11:32 PM
KrishnaKhniyaji,
Tyati saro vatna man cha vane malai tapahin ko phone no E-mail garnus.....gaf garaunla ni.....I am serious hai......malai pani tapahin sanga gaf garna man laageko cha.....ma ta ahile nai phone garchu ni......
mero e-mail.....trikaldarshi2002@yahoo.com.......ho...
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| krishna |
Posted
on 02-Dec-02 11:59 PM
ok trikal jyu..aba yaha ta bhannu bhayena mero number feri kanya haru ko jamat lagera phone aulan ra mero room mate rishaula....tehi bhayera ma tapainlai sutukka email ma mero phone number pathauchu ni huncha trikaldarshi maharaj?? guff hanaula dui jana milera kaso??
you can send me an email at kobain12_3@hotmail.com
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 12:07 PM
To all who are bent on proving " who is Fraud or Not":
The simple, yet beautiful fact about faith is What you bring away from your faith!
And yet there have been killings in the name of Jesus, Allah, Ram Krishna.............and the list is loooooooong! How many have killed in the name of Baba?
If the definition of Godhead is a necessity:
Who is to define Godhead? What are the criterias for the definition?
There is such a thing called "Shraddha" and if someone gains something from believing in the philosophies of Sai Baba, so be it!
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| krishna |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 01:46 PM
The divinity of godhood is something you don't just generate by saying I am God and everybody needs to worship me. It is a fallacy and the worst crime too. I have seen him being advertised like anything. His million posters have gone world wide and people from all over the world have had faith with him. Tell me, if there was such a holy being, would he allow his followers to make him a God in poster and distribute all over the world, being advertised viciously??
Having watched that video, there is certainly some element of fraud there. If he was a divine holy power, why would he crush the tablet with his thumb, convert it into bhibhuti and distribute it to the people?? He could have just reached his pocket take out bhibhuti and distrubute to people. Why does he have to show, doing all that that he is actually doing some jadugari??
However, if somebody have gained something with his philosophies, then I have nothing to say. My mother blindfoldedly believes his powers and so does my granny, my unt, my grandfather, so on and so forth. They believe him, let it be. However, I ask myself, is it my responsibility to enlighten them with the deception that has been practiced here??
Krishna!
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 01:59 PM
Krishna ji
I understand your points/concerns. Again, who is he so enlightened that he takes upon himself to enlighten other people's faith/lessness!
And yet...Allah had claimed himself to be God, and so had Jesus, and so had others.......... This, in reference to your statement on selfproclamation!
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| bhedo |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 04:34 PM
Sitara says,
"Has been my inspiration, and my mentor for a long time.... And I carry him in my heart"
Well Sitara, as a philosopher he might be deep, but as a jadugar, he really sucks. That's all I can say. Had he not opted to fool people by doing jadu shmadu, then perhaps I would have respected him.
Man, one thing really sucks. Why can't I edit my messages??
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| ruck |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 05:06 PM
A few drops of the ocean of Sathya Sai Baba's teachings, an attempt to encapsulate its essence, follows. Sathya Sai Baba urges mankind to:
Believe in God --for there is only ONE GOD for all mankind, though He may be called by many names.
Follow sincerely their respective religions and live their daily lives in consonance with the teachings of good behavior and morality.
Respect all other religions --for no religion advocates the negative and lower qualities of man.
Perform selfless service to the poor, the sick, and the needy without thought of reward or fame.
Cultivate in their lives the values of truth, divine love, right conduct, peace, and nonviolence and promote these values among all.
Be patriotic and respect the laws of the country in which they live.
www.sathyasai.org
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| rajaks |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 06:30 PM
sai baba my ass he is s dhongi. make people work on behalf of him and he himself act like a god .he is a sucker
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| krishna |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 07:24 PM
An average person with common sense and moral ideas and views can make lots of sense. What is the philosophy we are talking here?? Sai Baba makes sense with his philosophies and advices, I agree. But he gives what an average person with some common sense, already knows. I think before we talk about what his views are, lets first understand what philosophy is. Philosophy is nothing but a set of believes and ideas which comprises of moral ethics of a common human being. Yes common human being. What you eat, what you believe, what you sense, what you shouldn't do etc. It is all a part of what an average person's thought consists of.
By saying two or three things that makes some sense, one cannot be the divine holy power. By saying I am God and people have to follow me, one cannot be the GOD. I am not saying that he has to prove to me that he is God. I am nothing, just a common human being who believes in what he sees. And what I saw is a man who calls himself God, decepting people with common tricks.
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| sanunani |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 07:53 PM
Did Sai Baba ever claim that he was a god? Didn't he say...he just shows us the path to God??????
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 03-Dec-02 09:29 PM
Krishna ji
You have your well researched views...and are entitled to them.
Please let us be; those ignorantly trusting, mere gullible mortals...those, who have perhaps found solace in the most "commonest" of senses in our "mostest" , "direrest" of needs!
Amazingly, I have yet to find such in Bush's George Lucas-esque types of "Good shall destroy evil; the evil one....." kind of preaching! And neither have i found solace in mammoth worship...perhaps an indication of blind faith in myth, mythology, legends, scriptures, dream sequences........ a legacy handed down by years of mental conditioning to believe that sacrifice is needed to appease the Goddess Durga!!!
But I do digress hajur! :)
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| krishna |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 04:48 AM
Sitara jyu,
lau!!! malai ta duita chura le, euta le daya bata, euta le baya bata, mutu ma chattakka, dui tukra paryo hajur.
No your don't digress. You writings are profound. I have read many of your articles and postings, and I find them very interesting, glamourous, full of respect and vivid. You make an ignorant fool like me read two, three, four, five and more to understand your sense. And when I do understand it, I am left with nothing but praises for you.
Having said that, I have my own principle. I have my rights to either believe or not to believe in Godly powers. However, I do believe in external force. I do believe in miracles and I do believe in coincidences. But to go specific in God, then I have two minds on that. That is probably how I was brought up with.
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 06:10 AM
Krishna ji
Lau na...hehe ! :) tyatro compliments hajur!! My personal opinion about you is that you are an absolute gentleman...with a truly wonderful personality. :)
However,
You should know by now I am agnostic (...not believing in organized religion either!) and a zennist. Do I even believe in God...is another matter. I believe god is in every human being. Am I tripping? PERHAPS!!! But, I read all philosophers and take what suits me in my current mode of thinking... as long as such tattered pieces of philosophy do not cause any harm....I am happy!
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| Suna |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 08:28 AM
Pretty late in this matter of Sai Baba.
Plenty of unusual things have happened in my family who are staunch believers of Sai Baba. Am I a believer? I haven't really decided but I sure am glad that he brings solace to my relatives. If thats what rocks their boats who am I to trash Sai Baba, what gives me the right to make fun of someone else's choice? Its their's to make. Ko dhongi, ko satya? Manche ley maney dhunga ma pani bhagwan huncha natra kina dhai dhai mandir haru janu??
I also don't believe in organized religion. Do I believe in God? I have no clue!! I believe in the goodness in people. Will that philosophy make me a believer of Buddha, Jesus and Sai Baba? If yes, let it then be known that I am a little bit of everything. Why would that be anyone's concern?
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| rajaks |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 10:11 AM
ha ha ha! sai sai sai, well my sai baba is my baa and amma .who did all those sacrifices for me. not some dhoti from india.who i don't even know . if you have faith in you ,you will always get success in your life.if u work hard u will always get good result, rather than believing on some dhoti whom i haven't even seen ,i will always beleive in my hard work .like krishana said everyone has thieir own feelings i have my own .if someone think he/she is a god or some super power you always work to help mandkind ,like mother teresa,sitting in one place and giving speech to people doesn't make him sai, but it will sure make him a cheater.
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 11:17 AM
Suna
and I rest my case!
:)
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| krishna |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 02:45 PM
In reference to Suna's statement: I am glad that your family have had good results floating because of Sai Baba. They have received solace and enlightenment. You don't care if he is dhongi or a real Baba. But for once I ask you, do you believe in him or not??? If you say, yes, I rest my case.
But if you say No, then I have a question to ask for you. Don't you think that your family is getting FAKE solace from some Dhongi baba?? As for me, its better that my family doesn't receive any then some fake baba's enlightenment. I think its our responsibilty to tell our family of the fraud being performed here.
I completely rest my case!!!!
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| Suna |
Posted
on 04-Dec-02 03:31 PM
Krishna you either did not read my statement in its entirety or you just refuse to respect another person's perspective. If you read it again carefully, maybe it will make more sense during the fourth and the fifth reading.
But just to tickle your anti-sai feelings some more - I have had no interest in what that stone in front of Mahankal is capable of, I hear some dogs even use it as a fire hydrant BUT I respect the stone if someone else feels they've benefitted from worshipping it.
Krishna, as a parting shot let me ask you - Are you the type of person who will let people make their choices or are you the type who will make sure that they follow you blindly?
And please stop saying you rest your case because obviously you have not and do not want to.
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