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| Username | Post |
| ashu | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:41 AM
1. 50 years ago, on May 29th, Tenzing Norgay, together with Edmund Hillary stood on top of the highest mountain on the planet. 2. Tenzing was an illiterate porter who did not speak much English. Hillary was a bee-keeper from New Zealand who did not know how to communicate with Tenzing. Both were a part of the British expedition led by John Hunt. [Talk about globalization in 1953!] 3. Tenzing was 37 when he climbed Everest. 4. Tenzing climbed Everest after failing for 7 times -- straight. Earlier, he had tried to climb from both Nepal and China sides. 5. Dr. Harka Gurung has remarked that unlike other more experienced Sherpa guides at the time who just did NOT think beyond providing good portering and other related services to their 'sahebs', Tenzing had an ambition and an inkiling of fame that would follow him should he successfully reach the top. This was his ambition, his intuitive sense of what fame would be like -- not necessarily his technical prowess -- that set him apart from other Sherpas. Indeed, later, Tenzing said that he climbed Everest so that his children would not have to. 6. Tenzing was married thrice. He married women from village of Thame in Solu Khumbu, where he grew up. His friends describe him as a man who became fluent in several languages, who enjoyed being with friends, who laughed easily, and who drank with gusto. 7. Jana Kabi Keshari Dharma Raj Thapa penned two poems/songs in Calcutta in Tenzing's honor on hearing the news of the success. The Nepal government awarded him the highest civiian honor -- Nepal Tara. 8. Tenzing had had extensive experiences in climbing in Pakistan, India and Nepal prior to his Everest success. In India once, he was a part of a skiiing team where his competitor was late Julian M. Sobin, Nepal's Honorary Consul in Boston. 9. Tenzing felt more at home in Darjeeling, India, where the Indian government set up the Himalayan Mountaineering Institute and made him the director. Tenzing, a man without passport and visas prior to his Everest success, later took Indian citizenship -- much to the chagrin of Nepalis. 10. Tenzing passed away in 1986. Feel free to add your own thoughts and comments about/of/on Tenzing. oohi ashu ktm,nepal |
| Biswo | Posted
on 28-May-03 01:43 PM
I found this article at http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,6811-677804,00.html very interesting. -- About Tenzing's taking Indian citizenship and the much hyped 'chagrin' of Nepalese people: During 1950s, the border, or the concept of the border, between India and Nepal was not that clear. India was just born. Nepalese people living in various parts of India were considered as much Nepali as those living inside Nepal are. In deed, Paras Mani Pradhan, Surya Bikram Gyawali, Lila Singh Karma, Lil Bdr Chhetri, Dharani Dhar Koirala, Amar Gurung, Gopal Yonjan, Lain Singh Bangdel etc are some example of 'utaakaa' people who became 'yetaakaa' in subsequent years,without any hesitation. There is no doubt that Tenzing's residence was Darjeeling during the time he ascended the peak. I have never heard anyone claiming he was resident of any part of Nepal during 50s. But people treated him like a Nepali. And I see no wrong in that, because Nepali , at the time, was more a concept of nationality than geography. However, later Tenzing took Indian citizenship. After all, he had to take the passport of at least one country as that would be necessary for him to go abroad, and he took that of the country that he was residing. It is better to treat him like a hero, the man who inspired millions of other adventure-lovers, and the man who was born in Tibet,and who lived in Nepal and India, and who belonged to the mankind.No hard feelings against him are necessary. |
| paramendra | Posted
on 28-May-03 01:47 PM
" Tenzing said that he climbed Everest so that his children would not have to." That's curious! |
| paramendra | Posted
on 28-May-03 01:49 PM
Biswo. I have not seen such "open-mindedness" among many/(any) NSHCHMs ... on the whole "nationalism" stunt. |
| Bond-007 | Posted
on 28-May-03 01:55 PM
Well said! Biswo, You along with Sitara and IF are the best posters in Sajha. Its not that I always consent with you but still find them very interesting and thought provoking. My Kudos!!! |
| username | Posted
on 28-May-03 02:00 PM
One of the hidden ambitions of Tenzing is revealed thro his grandson- he was treated unfair, he was not knighted, deprived of the Sir title etc. " Tenzing chose to remain an Indian citizen and kicked off Nepalipana was because he was hopeful abuot the 'sir'hood as it was conferrable to nationals of Commonwealth but not to the Nepalese citizens " was a popular one among the elites and beaurecrats of Kathmandu of that time. God knows the truth !!! |
| username | Posted
on 28-May-03 02:01 PM
One of the hidden ambitions of Tenzing is revealed thro his grandson- he was treated unfair, he was not knighted, deprived of the Sir title etc. The rumour - " Tenzing chose to remain an Indian citizen and kicked off Nepalipana was because he was hopeful abuot the 'sir'hood as it was conferrable to nationals of Commonwealth but not to the Nepalese citizens " was a popular one among the elites and beaurecrats of Kathmandu of that time. God knows the truth !!! |
| Biswo | Posted
on 28-May-03 03:22 PM
Paramendra and Bond, Thanks for your kind words. Paramendra, what is NSHCHMs? username, I think the rumour was probably wrong. Knighthood can be conferred to anyone, Rudi Giuliani(?) just got that last year. However, those who are not the nationals of British commonwealth don't have to write 'sir' and/or they are not addressed as 'sir'. One can also argue that if he had been so interested in 'knighthood', he would have chosen Britain as his residence, instead of India. Becoming UK citizen would have been certainly more helpful. Tenzing's son[Jamling?] said that he went back to India because that was where his kids were, his family was.After he finished the job, where else would he go? Of course, he would go to where his families were. Of course, I wish he was ours exclusively. But we celebrate facts, and it doesn't make sense when we start celebrating our illusory longings and wishfully hoping that they turn out to be facts. |
| ashu | Posted
on 28-May-03 04:18 PM
At a recent "remembering Tenzing" function in Kathmandu, I heard the following argument. Background: Thanks to Bal Krishna Sama, the playright, who, upon a request by King Mahendra, came up with a list of about 14 national heroes (male and female) whose achievements were to be celeberated duing the Panchayati raj . . . Sama included Bal Bhadra, Amar Singh Thapa, mythical Raja Janak of Janakpur, Arnico or Balbahu, Bhrikuti and others. Argument: If Arnico (who subsequently migrated to China from Nepal) and Bhrikuti (who married a Tibetan prince and settled down in Tibet) are still considered to be national heroes (or bhi.vu.ti) in Nepal, then why not accord the same respect to Tenzing too? [For the record, however, late Naya Raj Pant, the historian, never liked and always complained against Sama's arbitraily producing a list of names, reportedly within two hours, to satisfy King Mahendra's demand for a pantheon of national heroes.] oohi ashu ktm,nepal |
| noname | Posted
on 28-May-03 04:18 PM
Ashu thanks for the insightful collections! There is a photo of Tenzing at the top of Mt. Everest, but not of Hillary. While asked, why, Following remarks by Hillary is noteworthy: "As far as I knew, he had never taken a photograph before, and the summit of Everest was hardly the place to show him how." **** Regarding citizenship issue, yeh...his family was in Darjeeling, he had a good job there as Director of some mountaneering School....and he definitely lived in India. But even Leading Indian media write him as Nepali. Memories of the Everest conquerors: Tenzing Norgay (R) of Nepal and Edmund P Hillary of New Zealand in the gear they wore when they reached the top of the world on May 29, 1953, at the British Embassy in Kathmandu in this June 26, 1953 file photo. (AP) (Caption of Online photo: The Times of India, Thursday, May 29, 2003 | Updated at 04:40 hrs IST http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/photo?photoID=47815092 ) |
| ashu | Posted
on 28-May-03 04:19 PM
At a recent "remembering Tenzing" function in Kathmandu, I heard the following argument. Background: Thanks to Bal Krishna Sama, the playright, who, upon a request by King Mahendra, came up with a list of about 14 national heroes (male and female) whose achievements were to be celeberated duing the Panchayati raj . . . Sama included Bal Bhadra, Amar Singh Thapa, mythical Raja Janak of Janakpur, Arnico or Balbahu, Bhrikuti and others. Argument: If Arnico (who subsequently migrated to China from Nepal) and Bhrikuti (who married a Tibetan prince and settled down in Tibet) are still considered to be national heroes (or bhi.vu.ti) in Nepal, then why not accord the same respect to Tenzing too? [For the record, however, late Naya Raj Pant, the historian, never liked and always complained against Sama's arbitraily producing a list of names, reportedly within two hours, to satisfy King Mahendra's demand for a pantheon of national heroes.] oohi ashu ktm,nepal |
| noname | Posted
on 28-May-03 04:28 PM
Here is one article about this BHIVUTI issue: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20030524/TENZING24_ART/TPTravel/TopStories Let me quote first para from the article: Tenzing Norgay is a national hero to the people of Nepal, but not to its government. No statue stands in that country in his honour. Instead, 50 years after he successfully climbed Everest with Sir Edmund Hillary, the Nepalese government angers its citizens by refusing to declare him a rashtriya vibhutis -- the title given to the Himalayan kingdom's most revered dead. |
| Logical Sense | Posted
on 28-May-03 05:02 PM
Hold on guys, let me be devil's advocate here. Biswo has put this internationalism very eloquently and I admire that. In recent years, Miss Koirala representing UNICEF for India and Mr. Thapa playing for Mohan bagane etc. etc. can be taken in that context and we should all feel proud of them being a good citizen first and then Nepali later. But, Tenzing's case is little different my friends. I am not so sure to accept his internationlism and citizen without boundary status so fast. What I know is he did not go to India because of his family ties and etc, he was really whisked away by Nehru in overnight James Bond style without the formal knowledge of Nepal Government and was given grand reception in Delhi and subsequently "Himalayan Mountaineering Institute" was established in Darjeeling and he was made life long director. Two years back his elder son spoke in a prestigious radio station promoting his book "on the footsept of father?" and a concerned Nepali asked on air regarding Tenzing's citizenship. This is what Jr. Tenjing replied "Oh my father had dual citizenship, he always carried Nepali and Indian Passport". When the caller rtorted that there is no dual citizenship between India and Nepal, he completely ignored the question. So, what I am trying to say here is, Tenzing really did not go to India with dignity. He was whisked away by Nehru, and in a moment of glory, he might have really not realized the consequences and accepted the offer. Also, he flip flopped in his story about who went first and lost the respect from Hillary. I feel these two actions (accepting Indian citizenship, and ignoring the pledge Hillary and he made to say that they reached the summit together) ate him away. And later part of his life he really spent in seclusion and really was heavily dipressed. Also, he hardly did any constructive work for Sherpa's and Himalaya as a whole. I feel he could have done tremendous to his society. So, I do give him lots of credit and his sons and grandson admiration but, I am not sure if I would put him in the pedstle as Bhrikuti (sacrificed to be married for the better relations of bad neighbors) and Arnico. - iti |
| Bhunte | Posted
on 28-May-03 05:57 PM
Hey folks, It may sound little bit unpatriotic, but let's learn from our own mistakes if any. First of all, we must recognize Tenzing's heroic achievement. I don't accuse him for accepting Indian citizenship. Let's dissect the case the other way. Was it due to his literacy level for him not being able to comprehend the future debates that could have been sparked byacceptaning Indian citizenship? As Ashu's original post states "......Tenzing was an illiterate porter who did not speak much English....." I won't be surprised for him accepting all the physical luxuries provided by the then Indian govt. Just think of oneself, why there have been so much brain drain of our ' nepali buddijibis'. It sounds little bit of comparing apples with oranges, but some analogy is still there for the unanswered questions. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:03 PM
[For the record, however, late Naya Raj Pant, the historian, never liked and always complained against Sama's arbitraily producing a list of names, reportedly within two hours, to satisfy King Mahendra's demand for a pantheon of national heroes.] It was not the late historian, but his son, Mahesh Raj pant who rasied this issue. During the Panchayat regime, he was the one to raise the questions of the national heroes, and argued that, Arniko shouldn't be included on the list, that all the kings of Janakpur were named Janak and there's no record of Sita ko ba Janak, Jayasthiti Malla, who perpetuated scoial reforms should be included on the list, Bhrikuti's background is shaky and why not include heroes other than Balbhadra Kunwar and Amar Singh Thapa who actually lost the war against the British. But oif course, both the late historians, his sons and students wrote for the Purnima published by their own organization "itihas samsodhan mandaal", so, maybe the late historian endorsed his son's views on this. Also, Mahesh Raj came up with a booklet which sparked much controversy then and which still does: Nepal Sambat ko Anauchitya ko Sambandhama (on the irrelevacne of nepal sambat). Too bad, our country does not know how to keep bright academicians in the country. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:08 PM
So, I do give him lots of credit and his sons and grandson admiration but, I am not sure if I would put him in the pedstle as Bhrikuti (sacrificed to be married for the better relations of bad neighbors) and Arnico. Logical Sense, I don't wnat to sound illogical, but, what did Arniko do for Nepal? He could have come back after completion of his work in China, but he didn't. He stayed there, lived lavishly with 6 wives and many concubines and just stayed there. 13 barsa ko umer ma gayo, nepal ma kehi na kehi.. Also, Brikuti pani raja ansubarma ko chori hoina bhanne sunincha.. ye baba, nepal ko real heroes ta thorai chan. sabai famous in their own fields, but what did they do for the betterment of the nepali society? |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:18 PM
also, let;'s celebrate tenjing's achievement. it doesn't matter whether he is considered a nepali citizen or not or if he is given any honor by the state. he is dead already, and his son, Jamling is busy collecting funds for sagarmatha clean up..I don't know how muych Jamling's trust has done for the clean up of Sagarmatha or to improve the lives of the people of the Khumbu region or Nepal.its like saying, hey why not give tenjing presidential medal for his achievement or knight him.. tenjing lived a very vague and ambiguos life because: 1. he was never clear on his citizenship. 2. he never said who reached on the top first. its not that we didn't celebrate or are not celebrating Tenging's achievements. Madhav Ghimire and Jana kabi Kesari wrote songs to celebrate his achievement :Sagarmatha sikhar ma pugdacha pahile nepali bhandai.. Instead we should be celebrating the achievements of other mountainers and climbers who remained nepali even after getting name and fame such as late Sundare Sherpa (climbedEverest 7 times), Ang Rita Sherpa, Pashang Lhamo Sherpa and the record breakers of this season. aaba gaali khana tayar.. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:19 PM
But oif course, both the late historians= both the late historian and his sons |
| Biswo | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:29 PM
>late Sundare Sherpa (climbedEverest 7 times), IFji, Just to correct this thing: Late Sundare Sherpa, a hero when I was in highschool, died in an accident somewhere in Himalayan region. He was supposedly very poor throughout his life. But I believe that he didn't climb Everest 7 times. He climbed for, what then was a formiddable number, 4 times, and that was a record for long time. Ang Rita Sherpa, the snow leopard, was following him , and his count was 3 at the time of Sundare's death. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 28-May-03 10:30 PM
bond 007 thanks for your kind words, but if read carefully, everyone in sajha has something interesting and thought provoking to share. so, i take your compliment as a compliment to all the sajha posters who force us to think, come up with arguments and challege the "conventional" wisdon in their own ways, with the ocacsional use of "persoanl" adejectives. namaste. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 29-May-03 07:19 AM
Biswo, Ho ra? i thought, or i was under the impression that he climbed everest 7 times. unless, i find evidence to bakc my views, i'll have to believe you (which i always do). Thanks for pointing this out. |
| acharya | Posted
on 29-May-03 07:20 AM
>>Repeated ascents are gimmicks: Hillary Hillary said Wednesday repeated ascents of Everest are just gimmicks. "After the climb, Tenzing and I both agreed and decided neither of us would return and climb it again. Why should anyone do it again? It is all gimmick now. It is not mountaineering," Hillary said. "It is all exciting but it has nothing to do with mountaineering." I just don't understand what's up with Hillary's attitude!! If people wanna climb 10 times, what's wrong with it? It won't take away his fame, will it ? He seems to be more like HahooGuru! |
| paramendra | Posted
on 29-May-03 09:07 AM
Biswo: NSHCHM = Nepali Speaking High Caste Hindu Male (I am assuming you are one, like the vast majority at the site)........ ashu: "...mythical Raja Janak of Janakpur..." It is not myth. It is reality. Physical evidence all over the place in Janakpur. Logical Sense: "....And later part of his life he really spent in seclusion and really was heavily dipressed...." Really? Bhunte: "...Just think of oneself, why there have been so much brain drain of our ' nepali buddijibis'....." Good analogy. isolated freak: "...all the kings of Janakpur were named Janak..." First time I am hearing this. "...1. he was never clear on his citizenship. 2. he never said who reached on the top first. ..." Moot points. 1) His ascent was a human achievement. 2) It is a mere technicality. Both reached together. Maybe neither of them set foot on that one square inch that might be the technical TOP. So what? acharya: "...He seems to be more like HahooGuru! ..." Where does that come from!? :-) |
| paramendra | Posted
on 29-May-03 10:45 AM
Newsflash: Hillary is now a Nepali citizen. Quite a twist to the Tanzing citizenship KATHA! |
| sparsha | Posted
on 29-May-03 10:50 AM
Many years ago I read a book on Tenzing. I don't remember what the title of that book was. I found the book when I was cleaning up "kaath rakheko kotha". It was an old beaten up relatively thin book . The book sounded more like an autobiography of him (Tenzing) and was written in English. I don't thinkTenzing himself wrote the book but he may have narrated the storey and someone recorded his account. The reason I said the book was an autobiograpgy because the "I" pronoun is used in the book as if Tenzing is writing. In that Book, he says that it was his seventh attempt that took him to the summit. There he put a pencil along other things given to him by one of his daughters (who died later I think). He also claims that he tried to climb K2 in Pakistan as well. In his account, he never mentions being born in Tibet though. In fact, I don't remember him talking about Tibet at all when he talks about his family. He keeps talking about Khumbu region and mentions his parents live there. He was also in Kathmandu when he was a teenager or may be 12 and was amazed by the city then. He says that he couldn't believe what he saw. he had never seen a big city before. When he was coming down from the summit, Hillary reminded him that since he is a famous person now people will ask him all kinds of questions about him and his nationality and Hillary prepared him to answer questions. Tenzing says, "when I was walking around Khumbu hungry -no one asked me if I ate a potato---now they want to know all about me?" (not verbatim). Tenzing says he was given a house in Nepal by the PM and also describes his meeting with the King in Narayanhiti. Later he says that Neheru met him in calcutta and gave him everything he was wearing except his cap to Tenzing when Tenzing was leaving for England. He recalls, In englad (in his honor) stores were giving him free gifts whatever he or his family wanted. At one store, one of his daughters picked up a highly expensive camera and was not letting it go. Since the camera was so expensive, tenzing said he did not feel comfortable in taking it for free. So, he gave a less expensive camera to his daughter and Tenzing remembers the store person smiling at him. In that book, he never says anything against Nepal or Nepali (at least I don't remember). At one point in that book this is what he says (not verbatim) replying to a question who he is (a nepali or an indian)? "My body is made of Nepali soil, how can I not call myself a Nepali? my living is in India, and how can I not call myself an Indian?" My respect for Tenzing remains intact. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 29-May-03 10:51 AM
It is not myth. It is reality. Physical evidence all over the place in Janakpur. and what exactly are the physical evidence, parmendra? see, people's beliefs on certain objects/artifacts that do not even date back to 1000 years aren't really evidence of Janak's (sita ko ba Janak's) existence. Since, I am someone who is deeply interested in nepalese history and archaeology, i would love to hear about your physcial evidence of Janak's existence. |
| paramendra | Posted
on 29-May-03 11:01 AM
IF --- ever pondered upon the "Ram Janambhoomi" in Ayodhya? |
| Bhunte | Posted
on 29-May-03 02:14 PM
Hillary is honored with Nepali citizenship.... |
| Biswo | Posted
on 29-May-03 05:45 PM
>What I know is he did not go to India > because of his family ties and etc, he >was really whisked away by Nehru Logical Senseji, I like your perspective, but will you please furnish us with the source of this information. Btw, most of the international media I read these days referred Tenzing as Nepali. None of them said he was an Indian. It is safe to say that at the time of his ascent, he was probably not the citizen of India.It is also likely that when John Hunt or Hillary asked him who he was, he probably replied, "I am a Nepali." A lot of Nepali from Darjeeling region still do that. I am sure there are a lot of our posters who would correct me if I am wrong in this. Of course, we don't mind celebrating CB Raman, Ramanujan, Amartya Sen, Rabindra Nath Tagore etc as great people, and we never bring this issue of citizenship while talking about them. In fact, we are often very proud of what they did for all of us. However, it makes a lot of sense for us to seek out fact, and know them, rather than having some illusion, and celebrating those illusion as truth, as it seems to be in the case of Tenzing. |
| Poonte | Posted
on 30-May-03 06:42 AM
Sundare Sherpa dai le minimum pani 5 choti chadnu bhaako ho... I remember, in 1986-87 (?), being taken to a rally (from school) in honor of Sundare dai, and had to sing: Sundare Sherpa le...Sundare Sherpa le Aek choti haina, dui choti haina paanch choti chadyo re! He may have climbed Everest again after that too... |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 30-May-03 02:03 PM
ponte, 200 points. you are right.. biswo corrected me, and you corrected biswo. its more than 4 times, but less than 7 times. to know exactly how many times, click on the link. namaste http://www.nepalnews.com.np/contents/englishdaily/ktmpost/2000/feb/feb11/ |
| Biswo | Posted
on 30-May-03 02:36 PM
Poonte and IF, His #4 was a record for a long time, but I am not sure if he reached the top once again and then died. IF, the link you provided is not working, but anyway, thanks for the correction. |
| Logical Sense | Posted
on 30-May-03 04:45 PM
Biswoji, it is a fact that Tenzing was Nepali during ascent. A veteran Reuter correspondent who resides in KTM is authority in keeping records on Himalayan expedition for Reuters, whose records are valued by international organizations (like Guinness Book of World Records etc.). She keeps meticulous records of every ascent, for example Rehnolt Messner changed his marital status 4 times in four different ascent. What is important in these records is status of climber at the time of ascent. So, a person can be 40 on ascent and 41 on his descent. Anyway, it is very complecated database. Nationality is not that complicated though and does not change that much. You could write to her to get the authentic answer on all these records. It is a fact also that Tenzing took Indian citizenship afterwards. Also, you can call KQED radio in San Francisco to find out that Tenzing's son claimed 'on record' that his father had dual citizenship, which is definitely out lie. If he carried two passports it has to be 'illegal'. You can not have dual citizenship between India and Nepal, period. Also, lots of Sherpa friends from Himlayan Mountaineering Institute, and Nehru Mountaineering Institure of Uttarkashi talk about this privately. So, in my opinion, the integrity of Tenzing is questionable, no matter how much his sons try to cover it. Really speaking I have no problems if he accepted Indian citizenships that much, but, I am not comfortable about lying about it. I feel 'what else he was lying about?'. Just like I do understand the rational behind giving half of Mr. Everest to China by our beloved King Birendra, but, I am angry about not making it public. Also, lots of us ignore this fact but make big deal about half an inch land questionable enchronchment in Mahakali or Chitwan by India. My God, Mt. Everest is National monument don't you understand, and give it to someone just like that, and that half an inch is useless land, for God shake undertand it..... Also, some posters in here try to give argument about him being 'illiterate' as excuse for accepting Indian citizenship. In my opinion, integrity is not taught in School, you have seen many PhD not high in their integrity. But, a villager has more integrity because of their believes even though they have not seen a school. Any way, rant rant rant!!!!!! At times I feel more disenchanted with Nehru and King M and B than Tenzing. - iti |
| Biswo | Posted
on 30-May-03 07:17 PM
Logical Senseji, During the debate in this thread, I bought a very authoritative book by George Band, named simply "Everest", which was published recently. I would say that is the best book I have ever read on first Mt Everest ascent, despite my disagreement on some of the whining the writer does in the book. The book also addresses the issue of his citizenship. Tenzing was "probably" born in what is Tibet these days. It is worthwhile to remember that Nepal-China border has not been very well documented, and we exchanged a lot of lands while trying to demarcate it scientifically. In fact, Tenzing probably lived for 15 years there before moving back to Nepal. His mother was a Nepali, living in Nepal. Tenzing was a veteran mountaineer when John Hunt, the leader of successful Mt Everst expedition, hired him. John Hunt sounds like a very liberal "Sahib", and he was so impressed with the courage and amiability of the Sherpas that it was his wish that at least one Sherpa was included in every 'final assault' of Mt Everest peak. That was how a Sherpa and a Gora Sahib ended up earning the glory. Tenzing had tried to scale the peak a lot of times in the past also, with Swiss and other groups, and his experience was the reason why he was hired for that trip. John Hunt[a great lover of Nepal,he died in 1998] had also made sure that both Hillary and Tenzing, and other team members, would always maintain that the Everest was scaled jointly by both. Of course, on their way back to home, Nepalese crowd treated Tenzing as the first climber. In the carriage from Banepa(?), Tenzing was placed in a prominent place, while Hillary and Hunt sat somewhere at a lower place. Later, Tenzing was offered Nepal Tara in the palace which was awarded to the citizens of Nepal only. He was offered house and other things by the government. -- Tenzing died a depressed person. He became the director of a mountaineer center in Darjeeling, which, Nehru had said, "will produce thousands of Tenzing". I think Tenzing was not very much clear about the issue of citizenship. Worthwhile to remember is his own words in his memoir : "I was born in Nepal, and grew up in the lap of India" [not verbatim]. After reading the book, I felt that one could reasonably argue that Tenzing was Nepali at the time of his ascent. It is something like a Nepali student studying in USA: at the time of his PhD graduation he would still be a Nepali, but later he would choose to stay in USA and become US citizen. All glory he earns during PhD would still be earned as Nepali. -- Again, who cares about citizenship of Tenzing? He was probably a citizen ,by birth, of China, stayed in Nepal for long and died in India. |
| sparsha | Posted
on 30-May-03 08:05 PM
Biswoji, Just a simple question: Based on what are you suggesting Tenzing was born in Tibet and may have lived there until he was around 15? I still am not clear on this. Like I wrote above, in his autobiography he does not mention Tibet while talking about his family. When asked if he ever saw "Yati"? he replies that he did not but he saw foot prints and adds his father saw Yati. There again he talks about Khumbu region (right now I am not specifically remembering the name of his village he mentions there). He narrates an account of his visit to a bazar in solu khumbu when he was very young and also says how amazed he was when he first came to kathmandu at 12/13 (age). Anyway, I just want to know where this "born and raises in Tibet" concept is coming from. Hope you won't mind explaining. |
| Biswo | Posted
on 30-May-03 11:37 PM
Sparshaji, I thought I was clear about that. I posted almost everything of my last posting based on the book 'Everest' by George Band. I found the book very authoritative because i) George was a member of the team that first reached the summit. He describes almost first hand detail of the first ascent in the book, and the ceremonies thereafter. He also describes about Tenzing and his nagarikata issue briefly. ii) The book has been granted to print imprimatur of Britain's Geographical Society (Royal Geographical society?) and Alpine club, therefore granting some kind of authoritativeness by the societies who first organized Everest Expedition attempts. iii) Captain Hunt, who hired Tenzing in the team, seems to be a very close friend of Band until his death, and the book also has Hillary's foreword, if I remember correctly. Hillary and Band are still good friends. It is worthwhile to remember that later while demarcating the border between Nepal and China, some villages were also exchanged. |
| sparsha | Posted
on 31-May-03 08:47 AM
Biswoji, So, the book "'Everest' by George Band" suggests that Tenzing was born and grew up in Tibet? I am just curious. And if so, does the author say based on what or whose account did he come up with that conclusion or suggestion? The only reason I am more curious on this is because this account of born and raised in Tibet contradicts the autobiography of Tenzing I read (where Tenzing does not claim of being born and raised in Tibet. He does not even mention Tibet when he talks about his family-if I remember correctly). "It is worthwhile to remember that later while demarcating the border between Nepal and China, some villages were also exchanged. " I am aware of this. So, does this point mean to suggest that his village may have been in Tibet and later exchanged with a Nepali village? |