| Sajha.com Archives | |
| Username | Post |
| computer | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 10:38 AM
Read this--its interesting. http://www.centralchronicle.com/20030812/1208015.htm |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 10:48 AM
Budhha would be laughing at the human beings including all the monks in this world, if he's been watching his own bones being observed as the treasure and the followers going after that treasure rather than what preached for the world peace. Budhhists people who follows and practice Buddhism should deeply think why it is irrelavant to go after Budhha'sbones. It's just merely a style they are following what other people of varoius religions do. Buddhism is not a religion... and it's all about human psychology. |
| sewak | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 02:59 PM
Sadabichar: That is not right. You might have read some books yeta uta and might think you know everything about Buddhism. It takes more than books and way more than the way people think. Relic is an integral part of building monastries, statues and other holy objects. Only good practitioner and true believer can tell you how it feels like to see the relic or even to get a glimpse of it. Unfortunately people are sick and tired of being fooled by their religious leaders. On the other hand, there are many amazing teachers in Buddhism who are working tirelessly for the benefit of all living being. I wish you have one of them. But even to truely understand you need a good karma. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 03:11 PM
Sewak: No matter what you say, there is no significance of budhha's bone !!!!! What matters is his teachings..... |
| rendra wasito | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 06:18 PM
Sadbicharji, As a former student of Ananda Kuti High School, I find your comments very offensive. You are offending a lot of my fellow Buddhists. No wonder that you are a Brahmin with a Kubichar just like Ashutosh Tiwari. For many observers, cultures can come across as being fuzzy, vague and sometimes trivial or even mercurial concept. It can mean many things to many people, and for some, it has no place in the real world. On the other hand, Buddhist culture with its Buddha bones are symbolic and is personla, vlaue charged and emotive subject, which brings the need for a great deal of caution and sensitivity in the way it is approached. The dilemma is that it is too easy to trivialise Buddhis tantric culture by being too touchy-feely, and it is equally easy to dehumanise it by being obssessed with stupid Brahminism laden Hindu quack facts rather than meaning. Buddhist tantric culture needs to be understood in terms of what it means to its subscribers like me. What is so sacrosanct in one culture may not be so in another, and you are Yankeeised NEPE and lack the skill of due respect. Thus, you feel that this practice of ritual is not necessary. My understanding and respect for other cultures is based on respect for other people's values no matter how alien, strange or unreal they may appear to me. THERE ARE OFTEN DEEPER MEANININGS THAN WHAT WE SEE ON THE SURFACE. I recommend that you hold your judgement by asking "What am I seeing ?" Buddham Saranam Gachyami Sangam Saranam Gachayami.... |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 08:43 PM
You have a problem with 'attachments' issues. That's not what Budhha preached. It's not even important where Budhha was born. People make lot of noise claiming that Budhha was born in nepal.. that doesn't mean that Nepal get's priority in achieving peace. To achieve the peace you have to work hard on your own. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 10:26 PM
Best of the paths is the eightfold, best of the truths the four; best of the virtues is freedom from attachment; best of the people is the one who sees. This is the path; there is no other that leads to the purifying of insight. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 10:31 PM
When Buddha was about eighty, a blacksmith named Cuanda gave him a meal that caused him to become ill. Buddha forced himself to travel to Kushinagara, and laid down on his right side to rest in a grove of shala trees. As a crowd of followers gathered, the trees sprouted blossoms and showered them on Buddha. Buddha told Ananda, "I am old and my journey is near its end. My body is like a worn-out cart held together only by the help of leather straps." Three times, Buddha asked the people if they had any questions, but they all remained silent. Finally Buddha said, "Everything that has been created is subject to decay and death. Everything is transitory. Work out your own salvation with diligence. After passing through several states of meditation, the Buddha died, reaching Parinirvana (the cessation of perception and sensation). |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 10:37 PM
Budhha said: Do not dwell in the past, do not dream of the future, concentrate the mind on the present moment. So why after Budhha's bones? That's not important at all.. what is important is practice the budhhism objectively, in real daily life. |
| rendra wasito | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 11:29 PM
You dopey block head just read what is in script. Without the practice of ritual Buddhism would be dead. Symbolism of bone is an artifact of that ritual you fool. Imagine a latoo spinning and that is dynamic communal participation through give and take through ritual of that Buddhism. Without symbolism and ritual not being practice then imagine a latoo not spining and lying flat in the ground. Bone of the saints are also important as symbolism and for ritual in Christianity....the skeleton of Saint Asissisi in Italy. You are just a Kubudi daar Brahmin and want to bring script for being the middleman between the Buddha and Sanga....We don't need you and we consider hair, nails, bones and other artefacts of the Buddha to remind us stmbolically that he is still with us. What is the point if you do not understand the script, symbols, metaphors,similie and much more for a richer interpretation of Buddhism and that is ritualised by the whole community. Thus, we need no idiotic Brahmanic chal kapat termed bramhajal. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:19 AM
And what makes you think that I am a brahmin? You are swayed by the sentiments!!! |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:31 AM
.....script, symbols, metaphors,similie .... These are all human-created .. even what we think in our language is based on the words humans created... sometimes words could be quite confusing and inadeqaute to understand the truth. But whether there are words or not... ultimate truth remains the same... what is important is pursue that ultimate truth by yourself.. (as I understand) this is what Budhha's main teaching. We may get all the details of path to Nibbana (nirvana) from the enlightened... but that doesn't lead you to that Truth... we must walk the path yourself. We should not stuck with Budhha's hair, nail, bones etc.. but his teachings/philosophy is a great tool to achieve that goal. Remember, Buddha asked all his descendents (followers, or whoever) not to have Budhha's idols/statues to be built at all. Ironically, at present, the most idols/statues built are that of Budhha, and none of the others. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:36 AM
The world, indeed, is like a dream and the treasures of the world are an alluring mirage! Like the apparent distances in a picture, things have no reality in themselves, but they are like heat haze. - Buddha |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:37 AM
One more here... Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. - Buddha |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:46 AM
Most importantly we should try to understand what Buddha was trying to say: "I gained nothing at all from Supreme Enlightenment, and for that very reason it is called Supreme Enlightenment." |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:48 AM
Finally the last words of Buddha were: Decay is inherent in all compounded things. Strive on with diligence. |
| dhananjya | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 12:10 PM
Dear friends, A prince who saw misery in this world and renounced to find the way out of it. He found the way and first walk on it and came out of his all misery. Then he saw the way to others and helped many to walk in this wonderful path. He named the way as Dhamma. He always gave important to Dhamma. He used to say It is Dhamma which will liberate you. So follow the Dhamma. Many people used to come to worship him. He taught how to worship: IMAYA DHAMMA NU DHAMMA PATIPATIYA , BUDDHAM PUJIME, DHAMMAM PUJIME, SANGHAM PUJIME: Meaning------practicing gross dhamma(Sila) to subtle dhamma(pannya) I am worshiping Buddha, worshiping dhamma and worshiping sangha. This is real worship. This tradition is still maintained in some schools where buddhas teaching survives in pure form. In Buddhas teaching he gave total importance to Dhamma, the teaching. His words: DHAMMAM SARANAM NA ANNYA SARANAM; Meaning, take refuse on Dhamma not on something else. We can see in Tipatak, he is praising to those who are ardently following the Dhamma. ie who are practicing utmost. He used to say: ISAM DIWA CHHA RATTO CHHA NITTYA KAYAGATA SATI: Meaning by day and night everymoment keep your attention on what happens on the body. When he was passing away, Anand asked him that who will be the leader after him. He answered that the Dhamma will be leader. It will be dhamma which will lead the sangha. He told to one monk who always wants to be with him that if you are not practicing dhamma, then you are far far away from me even you are physically holding my rob. But if you are practicing dhamma, you are closest to me, eventhough you are far far away physically. Tipathik is full of such examples where he is giving importance to Dhamma. Contd&& |
| sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 12:34 PM
That's exactly what I wanted to convey here, Dhananjya. Ananda always travelled with Buddha wherever he went, Ananda was always with Buddha, and thus Ananda heard Buddha talking everyday and everything. Ananda had exceptional memory power, and thus he remember each and every word spoken by Buddha... so sharp was Anand's memory that it made possible to document Buddha's teachings after the demise of Buddha due to Ananda. However, although Anand heard and imprinted all the words spoken by Buddha, it didn't lead him to Nibbana. He knew the path to Nibbana as told by Buddha.. but he had to work on his own to walk through that path and achieve Nibbana later on. |
| sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 12:36 PM
Therefore, let's walk the path of DHAMMA and live wholesome life to achieve Nibbana. Forget about Buddha's bones.. that's only a distraction!!! |
| dhananjya | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 01:30 PM
Dear sadabichar, There is no doubt that Buddha used to give all importance to Dhamma and only dhamma. whatever he taught was science pure science, pure law of nature. Whatever he did he explain the reason behind it. He asked to make Stupas on his bones. He gave hairs to make stupas to merchants form Burma. It is Swadagon pagoda which was built in the life time of Buddha. Buddha asked to make shrine on Sariputta and Moggalians bones. He did that work on his own. So my friends, there is important of this system also. There are two reasons after making Pagoda on Buddhas bone. First reason to get inspiration for practice and second reason is vibration. Buddha used to give more and more importance to vibration. In Annanda bodhi he meditated for one whole night in Nirodha Sammapatti, as per request of other monks. He said it s for good vibration for future meditators. He stops some vikkhus to go to some places. He said there is no good vibration. So reason after these shire is vibration, but most important thing is practice. Buddha used to say, if you are practicing dhamma. if you are practicing Sila, Samadhi and pannya, you are paying homage to me otherwise not. If someone really practice pure buddhas teaching and gets stablished in it, one will cry out of volition to Buddha. That is real devotation to budhha, that is real Buddhist. If someone practicing teaching and not feeling any graditute towards him, there is something wrong with this practice. Gratitude is a pure quality. One must be grateful to someone who gave him a glass of water. He is getting a technique from Buddha which will dragging him out from the misery of sorrow. Graditute must come towards him. In this sense one has to give importance to Buddha. If there were no Buddha how could I get this wonderful non sectarian, pure dhamma. such feeling should arise. This importance is enlighten importance. Same for the sangha. Sangha saved the teaching since senturies and I got it. With this technique I am cleaning my impure mind and getting happiness. Oh sangha I thanks to you. I obliged to you. in this sense one will give importance to sangha. Contd&&. |
| babaji | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 01:44 PM
"The Buddha, born prince Siddhartha to a royal family in Nepal in 563 BC, renounced his kingdom to preach non-violence. The founder of one of the major religions in the world, his death in 483 BC has inspired legions of myths, literature, art and films and still continues to do so. Legend has it that after his death, his bones were interred in eight ancient cities." Does this sound logical? According to an article, Buddha died b4 he was born. Or does BC counts backwards??? |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 01:53 PM
Yes, BC is counted backwards!!!! |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 01:54 PM
BC = Before Christ. |
| rendra wasito | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 04:30 PM
Whenever you novices come to the House of Buddha then I have to slap your faces. Why ? You ain't know what it means to be a REAL Buddhist. Both Kubichari and Dhananjaya only are reactive wannabe Buddhists like the born again Christians from the sourthern bible belts of USA. What is in the script that is the truth as a science. I tell you both it is quackary. Tripitaka is creation of man/marketer just like me. Diamond sutra, Lotus sutra and muchmore is a creation of man/marketer just like me....it has US$ value....and who has US$...can be Chakravartin....Hey, man have Buddha's bone crush it up into billions of atomised particles and embed them in holy water bottles and ye can reap US$ billions from the blind faithfuls....I am a practical man and value the bones to be converted into valueable merchandise...what is wrong with it if it is the basic needs and wants of the Dhamma consumers or bums ? Buddha said so and so and it was simple...Jesus said so and so and it was simple....However, after both Mesiahs' death empires were created in their names politically and monetarily. Catholic Church was the first multinational corporation in the name of Christ. Thus, the Vatican under the black and heritic pope had banks like Ambrisiano (now bankrupt) and took part in money laundering, supplying arms to IRA, ran homosexual brothels and much more. Same goes with the Buddhis world of Mahayana, Hinayana and Vajrayana. It is indeed man made institutions are fallible. Man needs the three elements of Buddhism of Buddha, Dharma and the Sangha. Likewise, Crristianity requires the majesty of mystery being the father, the son and holy ghost. Hinduism needs the mystery of Bhrama, Vishnu and Shiva. So to just rely on man made Tripitaka is to be bewitched with "MONKEY MAGIC" called Brahmajaal, Chal kapat or maya jaal of the Hinayana (little vehicle) led monks that declare that they can be the Buddha here and now or Lamajaal led by Dalia lama who declare the yellow hat sect is the supreme as they are the chosen ones by the Buddha and forbid workship of other deities and so forth.... You irrational and pin head mumbo jumbo workshippers argue among yourselves till the cows come home....Good luck. I amnot interested in your bullshit. As a marketer, I am interested in the Buddhism related markets and want to create value through synergies. If Buddhist consumers want a uddha statue with a piece of Buddha bone in it I will sypply this merchandise with great pleasure. It only has to be needs and wants based for the exchange in this value creation. Furthermore, I can attach the Buddha's image with disco lights and even provide the Buddha doll with Pali words based on the scripts. Oh ! we miss his tape recordings of the preachings....otherwise it would be so authentic and we could make more money to create Buddha real nostalgia.... So what a wonderful world of US$$$$$$$$$$$$$ making by creating the Buddha real cosmology with his hair, bones, tooth, piss, blood, pooh and really anything under the sun. Don't the Catholic Church do the same in the name of Jesus blood they sell ecclestial wine or Twat and charge huge money that is blessed by the black heretical pope. The chruch charges more money for pau roti bread as Jesus's flesh...and so on. Hey man i am a practical mahamarketer and do not need to listen to you bizarre parrots, who do not understand the Buddha based money markets. No wonder you sound always a Maha Magne Monks of various mumbo jumbo Buddhist Mahavihars and are paisewisealways bankrupt. At least some Monks in Thailand took my advise and are selling talking Buddha idols with disco lights, dead Vishu ash turned into tantric amulets to remind him and Buddha and so forth....Hey, the Buddha based markets were created by Buddha himself as he introduced the Budhhadar Kathamaya ramro/naramro COSMOLOGY that is so fab/fantastic....Thus, due to this imagination the marketers can create value and charge plastic Mcfantastic credit cards by the heaps and this is modern Buddha magic and only the parrotlike Buddhus miss out.... Buddham saranam gachayami Dharmam saranam gachayami sangam saranam gachayami..... |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 10:16 PM
You still have my compassion... Dear Rendra |
| rendra wasito | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 11:11 PM
visit http://www.sagarmatha.com.au and tell me your compassion is just like this place that you will have a cunnilingus with this parrot from Pyuthan. I am that I am. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:28 AM
Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one getting burned. --Buddha |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:28 AM
What we think, we become. --Buddha So Rendrajee.. you are responsible for your way of thinking.. only you.. no one else. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:29 AM
An insincere and evil friend is more to be feared than a wild beast; a wild beast may wound your body, but an evil friend will wound your mind. --Buddha |
| dhananjya | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 01:29 PM
Dear rw: Please forgive me if I am tough to you, I don t mean to hurt anybody. There are many reasons for different people to involve in discussion. 1. to kill time 2. to have fun 3. to share views 4. to look for someone lost 5. to find some new friends 6. to inflate ego showing ones great wisdom and craft 7. to help others with ones knowledge out of compassion 8. to learn form wise one raising questions etc etc. There may be more than these. So I might have been here, out of any one or more than one reason. Please dont generalize that I came here to argue with you. I have no intension of argument, neither is that my nature. I just put forward what I know, which may be helpful to somebody. So by chance, if on my postings, there is answer of your question and it goes against you, forgive me my brother. I have no intension to argue with you because I have no confident on my own that I can change your view. View is the hardest fitter to cut down. I read you indifferently, but I never try to influence you with my writings. My views are pragmatic, scientific, non sectarian and for welfare. I urge you to keep your mind calm and read me indifferently. Without prejudice. If you are disagree, I have no objection. You will find me always talking about Dhamma not about you at all. I will speak no single world about your life, your way of living, your livelihood, your thinking and your personality, you mentioned. so I am not in argument at all. Hey dude, sorry, I afraid of arguments and debates. My postings are continuous and the third posting will come up shortly. This is just a message this is not my posting. |
| ozdownunder2 | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 04:44 PM
But Buddha was a simple man and he said simple things. You both are repeating over and over. If you had received a Buddha seed then you would be an original Buddha out of that seed in your own right and no need to be a copy cat Buddha no ! Try to be Orginal my Buddha brothers and stop copying the Adhi Buddha called Sakyamuni. Be a Buddha in your own right here and now and this is my humble invitation. I am that Iam. Tathastu. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 05:48 PM
Impermanence is the law of Nature.... nothing is permanent. Good to see how Rendra wasita changed to ozdownunder2. Yes, very true... You are that you are!!! |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 05:49 PM
But you are what you were not. |
| ozdownunder2 | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 06:02 PM
At least I have taken the Buddha seed and am that I am and getting better everyday to be the original Buddha minus the Adhi Buddha and one day I will be a great Banyan Tree to gve shade to the needy pilgrims. That you are not and will be not as I am that I was and will always remain that I am. Tathastu ! |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 06:07 PM
Thank you for your admittance. |
| Sadabichar | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 06:10 PM
But remember just by changing your name you cannot change your mind. |
| dhananjya | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:34 PM
Contd&. Now question is what Buddha used to teach? He is used to teach very simple technique and he used to name it as Dhamma. This name is still in use. He was a prince and renounced his palace seeing misery in life . He was in full comfort and luxury but he thought he can not escape old age and death. So those luxuries and comforts were impermanent and meaning less for him. They are meaning less indeed, if we are wise enough to analyze like him. So he renounced in search of ultimate happiness, which lasts for ever. After long try, he realize the way. The walk the way to and fro. Found perfect. he realized that there is no more misery left in him. Then he decleared himself an awakened one, Buddha. The way, walking along which, he eradicated his all source of misery, he called it as Dhamma. So Dhamma is the path of liberation. Dhamma is the way to happiness. He systematize this path. He divided it into three branch. Actually if you further divide this path, it will be eight fold noble path. So he named it as ARIO ATTANGIKO MAGGO; means: eight fold noble path. The word Arya is qualitative word. It means an enlighten person. It has nothing to do with Arya family. But now days the word represents some group of peoples. Let me tell his teaching in summery. 1.sila: moral precepts: these are five a. not to kill b. not to steal c. not to do sexual misconduct ( householders should limit their relation within the spouse) d. dont speak lie, backbiting, hard words and unnecessary things. e. Not to be intoxicated 2. Samadhi: this is concentration of mind. Get mastery over the mind. Fixed your mind in one spot but real spot. No imagination, no extrapolation. 3. Pragya: this is wisdom. The understanding of real nature of mind matter phenomena. How mind and matter are interrelated. What is going on with oneself. And how mind matter interaction leads to habit pattern. How habit pattern bound us to suffer. Its self inspection. Its self understanding. As you start to see the mind matter phenomena as it is, without reaction, then your mind start to get cleaned up automatically. This is surprising law of nature. not a matter of argument. You can realize yourself. Just see the reality manifesting on you, as they are, your negativities will start to get eradicated. Amazing. Test yourself and then believe. This is his main discovery. He named it as Vipassana. Vipassana means, visesena passatiti vipassana. Meaning: see the reality as it is. Not as it appears to be. This sounds easy but if you start practice, one of the hardest job of ever. Not impossible but hard. Pretend you are a research scientist. Your object of understanding is you on your own. What research scientist need to study? Concentration. So you need concentration i.e. Samadhi, second stage of Dhamma for Pragya i.e. self inspection. To know yourself, to do study of your body and mind, you must have form mind, unwavering mind, concentrated mind, still mind. Samadhi is to make mind still, form, unwavering. So what is the use of first state i.e. Sila? Well if you dont observe those five precepts, your mind will not calm down, it will not be still, it will not be form, it will be wavering. It will be very hard for you to concentrate. It will be very hard for you to get mastery over it. So all three are related. Sila helps Samadhi and Samadhi helps Pargya. Observing five moral precept helps to develop concentration and concentrated mind can see the reality as it is i.e. can generate wisdom, pragya. So to practice vipassana, you need to develop concentration and to get mind concentrated you must observe five moral precepts. All these three combined are known as Dhamma. or Dharma. Practicing vipassana, mental defilements are eradicated. If all mental complexes are get eradicated, that is called liberation from Dukkha. Liberation from misery, Mokshaya. Misery is due to defilements, so if there are no defilements, there is no misery. Hence, sila (precept) is for Samadhi (concentration) and Samadhi is for Pragya (wisdom) and Pragya is for Vimutti (liberation). This is a path of Mokshya. And only way to reach to the destination Mokshya is walking walking and walking. there will be no miracle. no blind belief will help. May this posting be helpful to some of you. Dhananjya |
| ozdownunder2 | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:43 PM
Mind is not still till death do us apart.... Let the mind keep wondering and try to master it not to play tricks on you ! Now this Dhananjaya is being a rapid firing parrot what the Buddha has said and the world has come to know. This is not originality but a Mithya based on Mahamaya. One has to be a Buddha in their own Buddha form and that is the real essnce of Buddhahood by metaphor. Other utterances are just waste of time. Buddhism is not a rocket science and it is just commonsense. Now talking of sex and how many times sex can be done as this D prescribes are just nonsense. Tathastu ! |
| Rajendrarajbansh | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 08:41 PM
Hey you guys know more than budhha |