| Username |
Post |
| meera |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 11:51 AM
We were in Kundalini, my cousin, Somya and me were in the Jacaquizzi. Somya does not speak good Nepali but she was out to impress everybody with her limited form. “Hey didi, timro rumal ho tyo?” she said pointing to a towel. Suddenly a volcano erupted. “Malai kasaile aja samma ‘ta’ bhaneko chaina, timi haru ko ho ma sanga tesari bolne? Mateka baccha haru, parents have stopped teaching their kids manners.” She could switch from Nepali to English just so naturally. We both looked at each other. Somya looks at me and switched back to English, “Did I say something wrong?” I in a hurry said, “Let’s leave, I will explain later.” The woman could be heard grumbling.
After I gave my SLC, I decided to become a dayscholar for once in my life. It was a change, I actually felt so free. Then mom started taking me to relatives’ houses. I then realized that we had tons and dozens of relatives. In one of the Puja, one of our relative did not mean to make me hear (of course not) and said to my granpa, “Yo Meera kasto thadhi, bolna pani na jane.” Now what did I do wrong? My problem was that I had called her “tapai”. She felt insulted. And there I was thinking I was very good in respecting. My best friend would call both her mom and dad “timi” and for me “tapai” is quite a high form of respect. As soon as we reached home both Ama and granpa started teaching me to speak 'the right way', “Chori ‘tapai’ bhaneko ‘ta’ barabar ho, hajur bhannu parcha.” Come on, how can “ta” and “tapai” be the same thing? The three years that I stayed at home, I learnt many forms of respect. Too many levels if you ask me. Its not “khana khanu bhayo” its “bhuja jiwnar garibaksyo hajurle.” That is too tough, I will never remember it. You call your senior, hajur, your friends, timi. But for the workers can be called tapai no matter however senior they are to you. When I went to the SLC reunion last year, remember all the language etiquette that mom had taught me, “Ani timi haru lai kasto cha.” My best friend could be heard calling from the other end of the room, “Oye Meera yata aija.” I walked over and after saying hi to her told a didi who was standing in the group, “Ani didi hajur lai aramai?” My friends looked at me oddly. They must be like this is a new Meera. My best friend blurted out, “Apuii her na elsai, purai dina thalecha.” Everyone starts laughing. I turn red. She is one person who is more direct or "thadi" than me, I guess that's why we are such good friends.
How come we do not have a common word like “you” in the English language for everybody?
Wonder what they had in mind, when they invented all the forms of respect !!!!!!
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| oys_chill |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 12:07 PM
how come how come!!
how come they don't have words like tukrukka, bhutrukka, bhutukka, sararararara, chacha huiiiiiiiiiinnnn..etc.
as for "you", like the song goes, hajur lai , tapai lai , timilai talain, sablai Namaskar :)
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| niksnpl |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 12:15 PM
OH MEERA DEAR!!
Yastai hunchha pahila pahila.....
but don't get frustated..............
MISTAKES ARE THE PILLARS OF THE SUCCESS..............
(but actually they weren't your mistakes.....)
KEEP IT UP.....
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 12:25 PM
meerraaaa ,
bicharaaa meeru, kaaawwtooo problem.. don't worry meeru , it will be fine.. jhan dhak huncha ni hoina, English tone ma bolyo bhany ta.. I've some friends over here. they have married khernees or some of them have been just living in the usa for few years.Whever we meet they try to show off k, na sakee na sakee pani American accent bolna khojnay.. dikka lagdo...anyway, it's not relevant to your case.. but lil' meera donm't be frustrated... you just need to practice more Nepali..
i is never having problem with tapai, hajur,timi,ta or whatever .....i is always have them problemes in writing them queens language.. so kanfuseing.....
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| saroj |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 01:41 PM
Meera,
That's one thing about Hinduism that sucks majorly - which is the classification of it's people. People are superior or inferior to others according to their birth. "Maanish thulo dille huncha jaatle hundaina."
Even our language is very Class oriented for example using different forms of YOU. I feel that is one context of our society which suppresses free growth of individuals. For example when you're talking to someone who is older than you, you feel obligated to say Tapain or Hajur. As soon as you have to use the 'respectful' form of YOU, you cannot converse or discuss with that person as your equal.
I think one important aspect of the english language is that it provides equal grounds for communication, whereas in Nepali, you are bound by the different forms on 'respectful speech' so much that you have to accept that you are in a lower position or higher position than the person you are speaking to. For example if you're talking to a servant, you'd say "(Ta) pasal gayera churot ek batta kinera lya". - Your use of (TA) automatically shows you are in a higher position than the servant.
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| GurL_Interrupted |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 02:03 PM
Meeru,
That was fun reading!! I know, I always wonder too, why don't we have just one "you" like english language has! Esp. when I meet someone for the first time, I am confused as to what to use? Timi, tapai, hajurr? Where as in english language, I don't have to worry 'bout different levels of "you!" So, I guess, when someone talks to me for a first time, they think I am trying to show off or something! It's just, I dunno which "you" to use :-)! While trying to run away 4rm the decision process of using the right "you" in that situation, I guess I unconsciously use a firangi bhasa! Oh well!
But then on the other hand, I love the way "timi" "hajurr" sound! They sound more eloquent :)!
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 02:18 PM
poorrr girls, u girls are too amerikan.. i is have no problem.. it's yoru parents' fault that they put you in an indian boarding schoo and didn' bring you home in dashain /tehar,also i've seen that most Nepali parents in usa wants to be so assimilated to the main stream that they don't even speak in Nepali with thier kids. they kinda take it pride that thier little children is speaking in perfect American accent which they don't...
khoi.. i've been speaking nepali all my life and i've never had problems switiching from timi to hajur to tapai...you guys should give some time for your own language like you give for english.. hera english chahi aaunay ray Nepali chahi na aaunay ra.. what can be more confusing that the kherya basha..which has logic like
t+o= to ray, d+o= do ray, G+o= ghoo (achi) kina hudaina????
english jasto kanfusing language if you can learn, you can certainly learn nepali too.. just hang in there, hang in there...
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| GurL_Interrupted |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 02:31 PM
dyamn,
Have u met any of us gurls? Y r u calling us "too amreekan?" :(! I dunno 'bout others, but my problem is I ain't good at any languages so I'm like a 'pendullam!' Na nepali ramro, na angreji ramro! Hm...! but then I shudn't complain :-), least I know enuff to get by :-)!!
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 02:36 PM
hyaaa na risau na k.. ;)
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| GurL_Interrupted |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 02:41 PM
"Hyaaa" aba risai sake ke rey!!
J/K, ma kina risaune ni? Kehi karan bhaye ta risaune! Risayeko chaina! Take a sigh of relief! J/K! :-)! Okie, me out before I die due to lack of all "tions!" such as dehydration, nutrition, motivation etc etc.! Adios!
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| u_day |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 03:08 PM
Meera,
As your grampa told you, ‘tapai’ = 'ta' for 'pai' and aafu bhanda thulo lai hajur bhannu parcha. Gadha pani timi bhanda thulo (tall) cha bhane, "Gadha hajur" bhanna parcha. "hajur Gadha" bhanne hoina... ;) If you wanna be more polite you can also say, "hajur ta kasto gadha paji hoibaksincha."
Oys!
Those words you mentioned are called "paryayabachi words". Paryayabachi wor= word derived directly from the the sound made by action. eg, Chara chirichiri garcha ( chirichiri = sound made by chara). hawa sararara chalcha (sararara = sound of hawa)...... Oys Ghwarra gwarra sutcha (gwaraa = sound of oys snoring:p )
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| oys_chill |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 03:26 PM
sorry to say Uday bro, those are not paryayawachi words. Paryayachi words are same words with multiple meanings :). These are called Anukaranatmak Sabda...if my SLC serves me right :).
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| u_day |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 03:45 PM
oh well! my bad:|
It's been a while since I learned that. I got confused between Paryayachi and Anukaranatmak! If I'm not wrong, it's in the grammer section of first chapter in nepali book of class IX. I still remember the day when Tirtha sir taught us that, making sound of chara, gangata, and what not.
And there was thane sir, teaching us about gajar-mula and giving us all yucky thoughts:@
Anyway, thanks for correcting me, comfy!
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| meera |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 09:43 PM
Wrote the above story for humor.
Oys_chill, Niksnpl, dyamn, Saroj, G_I and U_Day thanks for the comments.
Taking of Gadha hajur, U_Day remember the joke about the two extreme form of talking styles, comparison between me and a certain Sajhaite :-)
G_I, me too have the same problem, na Angrezi ramro na Nepali nai.
Dyamn Bahadur ko lagi euta gana hai:
When you are damned and you know
And you really want to show
When you are damned and you know
Call yourself Damn Bahadur
Lol!!!!! remember my pre-school rhyme and remixed it a bit.
khoi, made so much fun of him and he still is not saying anything,
hmmm not like him.
what's that noise.
OMG he's coming after me with a stick
Meera @ running away
Giving a 100 meter dash.
hehe, kidding. Don't mind me hai, I like to fool around with you too ;p
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 05-Apr-04 10:35 PM
hyaaa meeruu moreee, katsi chwwweetttt.. choppaaa mooeee khayee deu jasto lagyo- rato rato galayeee maaa....
la la meru.. timi paper lekha.. hami pachi baat maram la hai...
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| OU812 |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 06:26 AM
Meera, thank you for spelling out the predicament most of us face. Ji, Tapai, Timi, Tho, Dai, Bhai, Didi, Bhani so darn difficult. Esp when socialising amongst peer group or when a cutesy you fancy turns around and says, "Dai ani aramai". What a waste..
An anecdote; A friend's friend who supposedly looks like Aishwariya Rai was feeling pretty down and out. A chap comes along and trys to cheer her up. At the end he asks her, "Bahini timi lie kiss khaam?" ... Hahahaha cringeworthy?
Moral of the story, life would be easy if there was something equivalent to "YOU".
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| Hellbound |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:15 AM
Meera,
That's true. It is so appalling to learn different formal words "tapai" "timi" for different people in Nepal; otherwise it sounds quite impolite in society you live with. But, is it really difficult to learn? My Psychology teacher said, “A children under seven can handle seven languages simultaneously.” If we can learn English and other languages in our childhood, why can’t we learn how and where to use “ta” or “tapai.” Why so much revulsion to follow our own culture. Is it just because you went boarding school?
Of course, there are so many analogies between different languages, but is there so much to learn in the language that you grew up with…the language that first came out of your mouth…the language that your parents teach you…the language that millions of Nepali speak.
However, I would say, we are affluent of language. As you know Nepali Devanagari has 11 vowels and 33 consonants, which English doesn’t have. Our script is essentially phonetic, meaning that the pronunciation closely maps onto the writing system. At least we don’t have to spell our name S as in “Sam”; B as in Bob… bla.. bla…
For your information, they offer some Nepali classes at Cornell.
http://lrc.cornell.edu/asian/courses/nepali
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| Taxman |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 09:44 AM
Hellbound,
Well said! Sometimes I find a "Nepali" or a "Non-Resident-Nepali" like you among bunch of "Americans" or "Resident-Non-Nepalis". Let's be proud of who we are our language and our culture.
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| Biruwa |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 09:51 AM
Exactly my problem too.
At home, I had always said hajur to mum&dad, tapai to seniors and timi to 'little bit seniors' to friends to juniors. At home, we were really informal.
When my sister married, I happened to call my bhinaju 'tapai'. I thought I was respecting him. Everybody present looked at me like I made a grave error and boy, did I get a good scolding from everybody. Nowadays, I don't even know how to talk to my bhinaju or any of my sister's inlaws.
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 09:56 AM
thik kura garyo hellbound brother lay, meerrruuuu timi layee kina bhaying difficultuuu???? okie okie, i'll give you some free coaching if you really having difficulties. Just emai me on my sajha email, and i'll send you some power point slides...I taughted euta khurnee and it took her like a week to understand .. i'm sure you can do it better than that... '
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| slacker04 |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 10:25 AM
knowing meera personally, she speaks nepali with sheer elegance. i have also heard abt all this different level of respects, like bakshiyos" n stuff. i personally go with "tah timi n tapain' n anybody having problem wit that, well, its their problem.
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| Spunk_Fluid |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 10:30 AM
I think Bahuns and Chettri's use the SYOSH, HAZUR, Garisyosh
the others seem to be content with Ta, Timi and Tapain
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| porcelina |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 11:10 AM
i dont think the 'garibakshyos', 'ghichibakshyos' 'haajur' are reserved for the bahuns... if i went to my parents and said 'haajur haaru le bhuja jyunar gaari bakshyo??', they'd laugh to my face!! i think that 'aiishyos khaiishyos' language is reserved for the royal family, or the wannabes. sorry!!!
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| Spunk_Fluid |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 11:34 AM
Maybe they created their own extra step of sophistication. Otherwise how does it explain the rest of the population not using SYOSH/HAJUR and only the Royal and royal wannabee's using it?
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 12:51 PM
it's not the case of wannabes it's about being what you are and taking pride on what you are. If bahuns and others have hard time saying aayebaksoyous, khyeebaksoyos and then they should quit saying it. If chhetries are trying to be like Royals then aren't bahuns and others trying to be chhetries - applying the theory of "wannabes".
Like some brother said up there you can learn up to 7 languages until you're 7?? I think those who think Nepali language is hard for them being Nepali are nothing more than plain posers ya, they are show offs. My khernee bahuju can say khayee boksoys , aaye boksoyes after marrying to my door ko cousin for 3 yrs. Those who were raised in Nepal and say i feel comfortable speaking english is nothing more than some hypocricts whose brain's raped by American/British cultural imperalism....
I would like to offer free Nepali lesson to all the lost and confused Nepalies, so email me if you are having hard time honeybuns...and majority of the time, i find Nepali chix having problems on speaking Nepali , why so?? do they lack some juice in thier coccunut or something??
ok you can kick my assszz now -- if you can catch me;) .......
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 12:53 PM
** those who say i feel comfortable speaking english in campare to Nepali
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| confused |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 01:22 PM
haha patner greeaat storry..i remember myself when i was in ktm..
i stayed in hostel for more than 8 yrs and i know what you are trying to convey in the story. i had the same problem at hostel..ani jhan i had many teachers from darrjelings so i had a habit of saying "kutta" "baksha" ani ettcc...haha my mom use to say i was being thaddee...when i spoke..but well ::)
anyyway greaaat story :D
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| meera |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 04:16 PM
Can someone tell me a significant difference between:
Hajur bhuja jiunar gari bhakshiyo
&
Timi khana khau
Eagerly waiting for the replies :)
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| porcelina |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 04:39 PM
big difference, but whats wrong with saying ' khana khaanuhos' to your elders?
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| Dominatrix |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 04:43 PM
Hey great reading here.. good topic meera.
Dyamn, just to comment on your thread, some 'nepali chix' may have problems speaking nepali because maybe they were not originally born in Nepal. So can u see how growing up in different country can pose a difficulty on their spoken or written nepali.
As for the 'garibakshyos''aiishyos, khaiishyos' my parents would laugh with sheer amusement if they heard me utter such formal Royal words. ;)
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 06:46 PM
Domin bro,
Those some chicks who were born and raised outside of Nepal don't complain about Nepali language, they try to learn . They actually do better than some Nepali chix born and raised in Nepal. I dated a Nepali girl born in Nepal but raised in the USA since she was 5, her parents left her with her host family when she was 14, and I met her when she was 20. We dated for 3 yrs, she had perfect american accent and she thinks in English but she does pretty good job sayin' "boksoys" , "jinar hos".
Also, it's not mandatory that you act like royals. And saying boksoys, jinar hos etc isn't all royal either, it's being what you are and folowig your culture and tradition. If your family don't say those things, simply don't worry about it.. my family expect those things if they're my elders and i have no problem respecting them with that tone.
khuernee, usa ma raised bhayako lay chahi bolna saknay.. Nepali ma raised bhayako chix lay chahi bolna nasaknay.. kasto language ho yo??...... "aadhi gagro chalchalkincha, bharee gagro chachalkidina".. bhannay sunayko cha bro??
na bro na risau hai.. malayee nakkal parayko man pardaina k.. tesai lay ali lamo lekhayachoo...
take care bro,
dyamnn bahadur...
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 06:50 PM
meera, hajur bhuja jinar garee baksoyos is for your hubby..
timi bhat khau is for your boyfriend...
lesson number 1... if you have more confusion lemmeee know sweepaaaa ;)
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:06 PM
actually i changed my mind.. i'm sorry.. i shouldn't be giving dyamnn to whatever -whoever says.. .. wrong of me to judge like that .. sorry about what i've written up there.. i take that back
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| oys_chill |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:14 PM
Dyamn bahadur bro,
you bring a vibrant smile to my face :). Like you said, it's jus the "prounouns" we were raised with that stick to us. Though "tapain" was the highest form of respect given in my home, i don't think anyone is trying to fashion the royals simply by saying hajur.At the same time, I don't think I call someone tapain and hajur just because of respect, but our language is so perplex that if we were to normalize our pronouns, we'd have to change many aspects of language. I do know few people who call their parents "TIMI" as well.Having said that, Nepali language is so unique I wouldn't want to change it for anything else just because some people are blinded by superior western values :).
One of the greatest pleasures I have found is referring online people as "HAJUR" regardless of their age, gender and sex. Maybe its because I have never used it before that i find it endearing, but don't really liked being called one. If people wanna take it elsewise, so be it :)
As for Meera's queries:
1) hajur bhuja jinar garee baksoyos : JUS before your shopping spree?
2) timi bhat khau : Khaye kha, nakhaye GHICH!: oh those moodswings!
My personal opinion though!
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| Dominatrix |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:17 PM
Hey Dyaamnn 'bro' i am a 'chick' .. hee hee!
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:34 PM
aaainnchhh dominaaa nanu .. hahaha aba nam nai testo rakhayko chau ta k bhanuuu.. haha....
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| Dominatrix |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:40 PM
Hare siva! Dyaamnn bro, hoina bhanya, do some research on my name, ani taha huncha maile kina rakheko tyo nam, hee hee. ;)
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| dyamn |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 07:59 PM
it says: a dominating woman (especially one who plays that role in a sadomasochistic sexual relationship)
tetai lay matra pugayna, i have to look for 'sadomasochistic' too, cuz i didn't know what that means:
The combination of sadism and masochism, in particular the deriving of pleasure, especially sexual gratification, from inflicting or submitting to physical or emotional abuse.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
wooooo hanky panky stuff huh.. ehehe.. Ya i is like them kind of women, with leather pants and whip and candle wax on my chest..... hmmmmmmmmmm..but they're scary sometimes.. what if they cuff you on thier bed to do hanky panky and whip out a jonny....
those chix are scary....them chix are seen in drag shows... them chickz wtih dikkszz
i is never take risk unless i make sure they're real chixxx.
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| Dominatrix |
Posted
on 06-Apr-04 08:06 PM
Hahaha..well done Dyamn 'bro', u did excellent research!
About your fear of 'jonnys' and such such, well funnily enough i was getting abit worried before when u kept referring to me as "bro." Hee hee! ;)
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