| Username |
Post |
| ashu |
Posted
on 29-Oct-00 01:03 AM
Hi Biswo and Trailokya,
Thanks to a friend, I just read
some web-exclusive interviews with
Chinese directors that appears on Time
magazine's Web site (Asian edition)
Those interviews seem to support
Trailokya's views in that fifth
generation Chinese movies were charged
with political symbolisms.
Anyway, be sure to visit: www.time.com
and find your way to Time's
Asian edition.
oohi
ashu
|
| Trailokya Aryal |
Posted
on 29-Oct-00 02:11 PM
>Hi Biswo and Trailokya,
>
>Thanks to a friend, I just read
>some web-exclusive interviews with
>Chinese directors that appears on Time
>magazine's Web site (Asian edition)
>
>Those interviews seem to support
>Trailokya's views in that fifth
>generation Chinese movies were charged
>with political symbolisms.
>
>Anyway, be sure to visit: www.time.com
>and find your way to Time's
>Asian edition.
>
>oohi
>ashu
Thanks ashu dai, i really enjoyed reading those interviews on Time Asia.
AS to your question, what do SIXTH generation directors say?
Well, they say they have to balance between the art form and the commercial form. They will have to fully go "hollywood-style" commerical or have to follow the footsteps of their predecessor(sp.?) i.e., fifth generation directors.
Are you aware of the group of underground "rebel" fim-makers of China? They make movies which never get screened because their movies touch on gang violence, homosexuality and the realities of the Chinese street life. They make movies for their own pleaseure.
(I myself haven't watched these "undergound" movies:-) but heard they are good, really good."
Trailokya
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 29-Oct-00 05:01 PM
Hi friends:
I think there are political consciousness among the
fifth generation movie makers.But ,probably not that
extreme.Western movie critique always fantasized about
internal rebellion in China and Chinese art,and tried
to interpret everything with their view, the view that
the CCP is necessarily evil, that people are quite
suppressed under its rule.
But ,hey, Zhang Yimou himself was accused of toadying
government when he made "Yi ge dou bu neng shao"(Not
one less). Irate, he withdrew the movie from Cannes
film festival.
The reality is probably somewhere between.They don't
like the government, they don't like the censorship,
but still they are not as that anti CCP.They are just
impartial, that is why they are great.
|
| Trailokya Aryal |
Posted
on 29-Oct-00 05:59 PM
Dear Biswo ji,
I am not saying that the fifth generation Chinese movie-makers are totally anti-CCP. They are to be seen as a group within the CCP who tries it's best to make the CCP realize its past mistakes, and that is being loyal to the CCP not going against it. You need people who can make healthy criticisms in any party and Zhang Yimou and Chen Kaige, Tian Zhuangzhuang plus I forgot the name of the guy who made "the black cannon incident" definately represent this group.
And, I don't agree with your view on US/Western movie critics. I think their views are more balanced than that of the Chinese critics because they are "outsiders". And you are wrong about them fantacizing "rebellion" in everything. Even the Chinese scholars now agree that art works produced during the Qing dynasty had a touch of that "rebellious" feeling. That's why artists and their works were closely scrutanized during the Cultural Revolution era China.
Now about Zhang Yimou toadying (I am using this word for the first time--doesn't it mean flattering?) the CCP--after having watched that movie three times in a row, I didn't find anything in that movie which makes anyone think highly of the CCP. Instead the movie shows the ugly aspect of dismantling the rural collectives, consequences of the haphazardly imposed economic reforms and the growing Urban-Rural disparity in China. If you have watched that movie, there is a scene in which zhang effectively criticizes this new class trend.
[scene]
This is when Zhang Yike is going back to his village. The TV Journalist asks
"what is the most "everlasting" experience you have of the city"
zhang-- (thinking for a while)-I had to beg for food in the City and I will never forget that. That's my everlasting experience of the city.
Now, this doesn't by any mean toadying the CCP.
Trailokya
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 29-Oct-00 09:19 PM
Hi Trailokyaji:
> people who can make healthy criticisms
>in any party and Zhang Yimou and Chen Kaige,
>Tian Zhuangzhuang plus I forgot the name of
>the guy who made "the black cannon incident"
>definately represent this group.
Huang Jianxin is the guy who made the black cannon
incident,I am pretty much sure.
>
>And, I don't agree with your view on US/
>Western movie critics. I think their views
>are more balanced than that of the Chinese
>critics because they are "outsiders". And
>you are wrong about them fantacizing "
>rebellion" in everything. Even the Chinese
>scholars now agree that art works produced
>during the Qing dynasty had a touch of that "
>rebellious" feeling. That's why artists and
>their works were closely scrutanized during
>the Cultural Revolution era China.
Sure, Trailokyaji.You are free to feel the way you
like.We can agree to disagree on this stuff.I feel the
degree of disenchantment against the government is not
in threatening level out there in China.I have this
feeling that while outsider critique has unabated bias
against the ruling party of China, the Chinese people
themselves doesn't feel that strongly.In fact, these
days any reasonable person seems complacent that the
country is getting better day by day.
Politically I don't approve of Chinese system.I have
been myself penalized in school for expressing my
that faith.But still I am writing what I felt to be
prevalent there.
>
>Now about Zhang Yimou toadying (I am using
>this word for the first time--doesn't it
>mean flattering?) the CCP--after having
>watched that movie three times in a row, I
>didn't find anything in that movie which
>makes anyone think highly of the CCP.
>Instead the movie shows the ugly aspect of
>dismantling the rural collectives,
>consequences of the haphazardly imposed
>economic reforms and the growing Urban-Rural
>disparity in China. If you have watched that
>movie, there is a scene in which zhang
>effectively criticizes this new class trend.
>
>[scene]
>
>This is when Zhang Yike is going back to his
>village. The TV Journalist asks
>
>"what is the most "everlasting" experience
>you have of the city"
>
>zhang-- (thinking for a while)-I had to beg
>for food in the City and I will never forget
>that. That's my everlasting experience of
>the city.
>
I never believe Zhang Yimou will toady(ingratiate) to
Chinese government.What I was writing was a fact that
people suspected: and the reason why yigedoubunengshao
was withdrawn from the Cannese Film Festival that Yimou
so much love.All those critiques in Cannes told that
Yimou was making government happy by making the movie,
so he withdrew the movie.
>Now, this doesn't by any mean toadying the
>CCP.
>
>Trailokya
Another thing is : I have seen quite a few movies and
teleserials which are critical to local government.
They are aired in state owned TV channels.Last year,
I saw a movie in which a minister and her son was
shown to be accomplice of smuggling scam.
Probably China is changing slowly, in every field.
Intolerance to criticism was never that acute in China
as they were in other countries with similar political
system.Even in Mao's days, in "Let thousands flower
blossom " era(probably 55-56!), a lot of discordance
were allowed.Deng himself was never a great fan of
neither Mao nor his fourth wife, but he kept on coming
back to power repeatedly even in Cultural Revolution
period.
I was more interested in Tiananmen square incident, and
did a little research on that while in China.The reason
why so many people were killed in the street of Beijing
was ,firstly, people didn't believe that the people's
army could fire on common populace.All their history,
the people's army was seen rescuing people from flood,
making dams and roads, and being very nice to people.
In fact, a lot of army regiments didn't want to oblige
the government on that crackdown, so they brought the
army from (was it from Shanxi?) faraway outposts.
What I think is:while people are fairly dissatisfied
with the government, the degree of such dissatisfation
may not be significantly more than that in USA or any
other country.
|
| Trailokya Aryal |
Posted
on 29-Oct-00 10:46 PM
>>And, I don't agree with your view on US/
>>Western movie critics. I think their views
>>are more balanced than that of the Chinese
>>critics because they are "outsiders". And
>>you are wrong about them fantacizing "
>>rebellion" in everything. Even the Chinese
>>scholars now agree that art works produced
>>during the Qing dynasty had a touch of that
>"
>>rebellious" feeling. That's why artists and
>
>their works were closely scrutanized
>during
>>the Cultural Revolution era China.
>
>Sure, Trailokyaji.You are free to feel the
>way you
>like.We can agree to disagree on this stuff.
>I feel the
>degree of disenchantment against the
>government is not
>in threatening level out there in China.I
>have this
>feeling that while outsider critique has
>unabated bias
>against the ruling party of China, the
>Chinese people
>themselves doesn't feel that strongly.In
>fact, these
>days any reasonable person seems complacent
>that the
>country is getting better day by day.
Biswo ji,
I don't agree. People are not-so-happy with the government these days and many factors contribute to this. I can write a whole paper on this.
let's just use points
Workers are against the govt. because there is no job security. I am sure you are well aware of dismantling the Iron Rice Bowl or danwei. Students and Intellectuals are against the CCP because of its human rights policy.
>>Now about Zhang Yimou toadying (I am using
>>this word for the first time--doesn't it
>>mean flattering?) the CCP--after having
>>watched that movie three times in a row, I
>>didn't find anything in that movie which
>>makes anyone think highly of the CCP.
>>Instead the movie shows the ugly aspect of
>>dismantling the rural collectives,
>>consequences of the haphazardly imposed
>>economic reforms and the growing Urban-
>Rural
>>disparity in China. If you have watched
>that
>>movie, there is a scene in which zhang
>>effectively criticizes this new class trend.
>
>
>>[scene]
>>
>>This is when Zhang Yike is going back to
>his
>>village. The TV Journalist asks
>>
>>"what is the most "everlasting" experience
>>you have of the city"
>>
>>zhang-- (thinking for a while)-I had to beg
>
>for food in the City and I will never
>forget
>>that. That's my everlasting experience of
>>the city.
>>
>
>I never believe Zhang Yimou will toady(
>ingratiate) to
>Chinese government.What I was writing was a
>fact that
>people suspected: and the reason why
>yigedoubunengshao
>was withdrawn from the Cannese Film Festival
>that Yimou
>so much love.All those critiques in Cannes
>told that
>Yimou was making government happy by making
>the movie,
>so he withdrew the movie.
>
>
>>Now, this doesn't by any mean toadying the
>>CCP.
>>
>>Trailokya
>
>Intolerance to criticism was never that
>acute in China
>as they were in other countries with similar
>political
>system.Even in Mao's days, in "Let thousands
>flower
>blossom " era(probably 55-56!), a lot of
>discordance
>were allowed.Deng himself was never a great
>fan of
>neither Mao nor his fourth wife, but he kept
>on coming
>back to power repeatedly even in Cultural
>Revolution
>period.
Biswoji, You are wrong here. Go check your sources. After the Hundered Flowers/thoughts campaign, there was yet another campaign in China called the Anti-Rightists Campaign in which people who criticized the CCP or offered suggestions were labelled rightists and were either sent to rural areas for manual labor or incarcerated or in some cases executed. Read Han Suyin's biography on Zhou En Lai, Johnathan Spence's Bio on Mao Zedong and also Fairbank's Book on China. Plus when you are in China again, talk to the people who survived the Anti Rightists campaign and the CUltural REvolution.
and a little correction there--Jiang Qing was Chairman Mao's FIFTH wife.
About Deng's coming to power--He was supported by Zhou. Handn't Zhou been there to support DEng, Deng would have been another Liu Shaoqi.
>I was more interested in Tiananmen square
>incident, and
>did a little research on that while in China.
>The reason
>why so many people were killed in the street
>of Beijing
>was ,firstly, people didn't believe that the
>people's
>army could fire on common populace.All their
>history,
>the people's army was seen rescuing people
>from flood,
>making dams and roads, and being very nice
>to people.
>In fact, a lot of army regiments didn't want
>to oblige
>the government on that crackdown, so they
>brought the
>army from (was it from Shanxi?) faraway
>outposts.
You are right here. However, this is irrelevant to our discussion. I suggest you watch "The Gate of heavenly peace" by Carma Hinton--William Hinton's daughter.
>What I think is:while people are fairly
>dissatisfied
>with the government, the degree of such
>dissatisfation
>may not be significantly more than that in
>USA or any
>other country.
Well, I don't understand how you measure the "dis-satisfaction" level of the Chinese population but majority of the Chinese population are not-so-happy with the CCP--mainly due to the ge te hu (private business) and dismatling of danwei.
Trailokya
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 30-Oct-00 12:09 AM
Trailokyaji:
1.It is with surprise I read the fact that Jiang Qing
is not Mao's fourth wife.Please furnish me the source
of this information.Until now, I always thought and
I can provide you a lot of sources that tells Jiang
is the fourth and the last wife(at least officially!,
and hey, her daughter is a waitress in a Beijing
hotel now,isn't she?) of Mao.
2.I feel quite uncomfortable to defend Chinese system.
That is never my purport.Since I had my own looong
experience there, I just can't believe everything
written in western papers.Likewise, I respect your
views also.There is a significant portion of populace
that are disgruntled with the government, I know.For
me,that is not abnormal.
3.When I gave the example of the "let the thousand
flowers bloom" era, I meant only of that era.I didn't
mean anything about the subsequent vindictions.
4.I find your assertion a little bit naive that Deng
was alive just because of Zhou. Surely, Zhou has been
instrumental in making him safe, but my idea is Mao
was so omnipotent those days in China, had he really
wanted Deng to be dead, he could have done that.
Some years ago, I read a famous book by one US
diplomat,"The two emperors", where the writer
furnishes reasons of why Mao spared the life of Deng.
Deng was lieutenant of Mao in their rebel days, and
Deng had saved Mao in two close encounters with death.
Furthermore, Deng steadfastedly remained with Mao
whenever internecine party struggle occured in the
communist party of China.
It is not without any reason that Mao, while in his
first trip to USSR after getting China liberated, told
his USSR host(Stalin) of Deng in a party hosted in
his honor:"You see that little boy?He may be dwarf
physically, but he is very perspicacious,and he will
lead China one day.."
We know, he did.
Biswo.
|
| Trailokya Aryal |
Posted
on 30-Oct-00 02:17 AM
>Trailokyaji:
>
>1.It is with surprise I read the fact that
>Jiang Qing
>is not Mao's fourth wife.Please furnish me
>the source
>of this information.Until now, I always
>thought and
>I can provide you a lot of sources that
>tells Jiang
>is the fourth and the last wife(at least
>officially!,
>and hey, her daughter is a waitress in a
>Beijing
>hotel now,isn't she?) of Mao.
Biswoji, there's a new biography of Mao Zedong out. Mao Zedong by Jonathan Spence, a noted scholar of Chinese history at Yale University. I suggest you read that book to understand Mao and how many wives he had.I don't know anything about Mao's daughters. Jiang Qing committed suicide in the early 80s.
>2.I feel quite uncomfortable to defend
>Chinese system.
>That is never my purport.Since I had my own
>looong
>experience there, I just can't believe
>everything
>written in western papers.Likewise, I
>respect your
>views also.There is a significant portion of
>populace
>that are disgruntled with the government, I
>know.For
>me,that is not abnormal.
>3.When I gave the example of the "let the
>thousand
>flowers bloom" era, I meant only of that era.
>I didn't
>mean anything about the subsequent
>vindictions.
Now, in your earlier posting you clearly wrote something else. Please go back to your earlier posting and read it carefully. Biswoji, the thing is when we talk about history, its not only the events that are important, what really happened after those events are far more important . So, in China, many intellectuals suffered because of the Anti Rightists Campaign, and neither you, nor me nor the CCP , whose rhetorics you seem to buy, can deny.
>4.I find your assertion a little bit naive
>that Deng
>was alive just because of Zhou. Surely, Zhou
>has been
>instrumental in making him safe, but my idea
>is Mao
>was so omnipotent those days in China, had
>he really
>wanted Deng to be dead, he could have done
>that.
Deng was used by Mao. He used Deng to show his dislike of jng Qing. That's why he called DEng back to Zhongnanhai. I urge you to read Han Suyin's biography of Zhou Enlai--The Eldest Son. Mao, himself never liked Deng. One more example of how criticisms were handled within the CCP is of Peng Dahuai who was the man responsible for Chinese Victory during the Korean War. When Peng criticized Mao for the disastrous "The Great Leap Forward" (da yao jun-1954-1958), he was removed from the post of the Commander of the People's Liberation Army.
> Some years ago, I read a famous book by
>one US
>diplomat,"The two emperors", where the
>writer
>furnishes reasons of why Mao spared the life
>of Deng.
>Deng was lieutenant of Mao in their rebel
>days, and
>Deng had saved Mao in two close encounters
>with death.
>Furthermore, Deng steadfastedly remained
>with Mao
>whenever internecine party struggle occured
>in the
>communist party of China.
Bishwoji, again. Deng was saved just because Zhou wanted Deng to succeed him. It was Zhou who bought Deng back, not Mao because Zhou and Deng has known each other from their France days.
> It is not without any reason that Mao,
>while in his
>first trip to USSR after getting China
>liberated, told
>his USSR host(Stalin) of Deng in a party
>hosted in
>his honor:"You see that little boy?He may be
>dwarf
>physically, but he is very perspicacious,and
>he will
>lead China one day.."
I have to admit this--I don't know anything about the state dinner. All I know is when Mao visted the USSR after the formation of the People's Republic of China (zhong hua ren min gong he guo), he felt humiliated and even told one of his aides that "all I am doing here is eat, sleep and eat"
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 30-Oct-00 09:29 AM
>
>>3.When I gave the example of the "let the
>>thousand
>>flowers bloom" era, I meant only of that
>era.
>>I didn't
>>mean anything about the subsequent
>>vindictions.
>
>Now, in your earlier posting you clearly
>wrote something else. Please go back to your
>earlier posting and read it carefully.
>Biswoji, the thing is when we talk about
>history, its not only the events that are
>important, what really happened after those
>events are far more important . So, in China,
> many intellectuals suffered because of the
>Anti Rightists Campaign, and neither you,
>nor me nor the CCP , whose rhetorics you
>seem to buy, can deny.
>
As far as I can read, my earlier posting was like this:
>Even in Mao's days, in "Let thousands
>flower
>blossom " era(probably 55-56!), a lot of
>discordance
>were allowed.Deng himself was never a great
>fan of ..
>
Here I was trying to give you an specific about the
era, not the subsequent vindiction.My understanding
about the Chinese Communist history has been this: that
it wanted critics,but it later feared them, feared
that they will do harm more than they will do good.
Probably because they no longer posses fibre to
withstand the criticism.Whatever the reason, There
were periods when criticisms were allowed.
>Bishwoji, again. Deng was saved just because
>Zhou wanted Deng to succeed him. It was Zhou
>who bought Deng back, not Mao because Zhou
>and Deng has known each other from their
>France days.
I don't believe in this, but it is too subjective to
reach into a conclusion.
>> It is not without any reason that Mao,
>>while in his
>>first trip to USSR after getting China
>>liberated, told
>>his USSR host(Stalin) of Deng in a party
>>hosted in
>>his honor:"You see that little boy?He may
>be
>>dwarf
>>physically, but he is very perspicacious,
>and
>>he will
>>lead China one day.."
>
>I have to admit this--I don't know anything
>about the state dinner. All I know is when
>Mao visted the USSR after the formation of
>the People's Republic of China (zhong hua
>ren min gong he guo), he felt humiliated and
>even told one of his aides that "all I am
>doing here is eat, sleep and eat"
The history goes like this:
When Mao went to Moscow after liberation, he was not
treated very well.He was kept in a government rest
house , and for three days ,Stalin didn't meet him,
nor he was accorded any state-honor.Virtually, Stalin
treated him like a commander of his own country.
Then, the western media reported that Mao was kidnapped
in Moscow.Because there was no news about Mao after
he reached there.To counter the western report, Mao
was interview by Russian TV.I suppose that is where
he said the words you wrote.
Then Stalin organized the official honor for him, and
then there was this state dinner I talked about.
|
| Trailokya Aryal |
Posted
on 30-Oct-00 11:40 AM
>
>As far as I can read, my earlier posting was
>like this:
>
>>Even in Mao's days, in "Let thousands
> >flower
> >blossom " era(probably 55-5
>6!), a lot of
> >discordance
> >were allowed.Deng himself
>was never a great
> >fan of ..
>>
>
>Here I was trying to give you an specific
>about the
>era, not the subsequent vindiction.My
>understanding
>about the Chinese Communist history has been
>this: that
>it wanted critics,but it later feared them,
>feared
>that they will do harm more than they will
>do good.
>Probably because they no longer posses fibre
>to
>withstand the criticism.Whatever the reason,
>There
>were periods when criticisms were allowed.
I don't agree. Chairman Mao was always afraid of the intelecetuals --thought they were counter-revolutionary and what not--as he himeself wasn't an eductaed leader. It was Zhou who was more tolerant to Chinese intellectuals. If it hadn't been zhou, Mao plus his gang of four would have definately done something bad to nuclear scientist Rui (something..). Zhou had to defend him too.
Criticisms were allowed, and in the mid 80's there was this campaign called anti-pollution campaign, and Deng urged the intellectuals to criticize the party and its policies, but again this turned into something like anti-rightist campaign and those who criticized the party thinking that Deng wouldn't do them any harm were either prisioned or had to stay under close scrutiny. For more on this read an article published in the Asian Survey , Volume XXIV, NO.9, sep 1984 by
Thomas B. Gold, Prof. of chinese studies at UC Berkley titled " Just in Time-China Batteles Spiritual Pollution on the eve of 1984"
The CCP policy has always been to let people criticize the party--once people open their mouth , then incarcerate them. So that thee remains virtually no opponents at all.
>>Bishwoji, again. Deng was saved just
>because
>>Zhou wanted Deng to succeed him. It was
>Zhou
>>who bought Deng back, not Mao because Zhou
>>and Deng has known each other from their
>>France days.
>
>I don't believe in this, but it is too
>subjective to
>reach into a conclusion.
well, to me it seems you ae either mis-informed about the Chinese History or you just seem to believe in whatever the CCP says. I studied CHinese studies in a college here, and was exposed to various events which I am sure you didn't get to do while studying in Fang Da (Textile University).
But don't think I am trying to undermine your position in this discussion. All i am saying is what I know was taught to me in school by Chinese and American profs, and I don't think they taught me anything wrong.
>> It is not without any reason that Mao,
>>while in his
>>first trip to USSR after getting China
>>liberated, told
>>his USSR host(Stalin) of Deng in a party
>>hosted in
>>his honor:"You see that little boy?He may
>>be
>>dwarf
>>physically, but he is very perspicacious,
>>and
>>he will
>>lead China one day.."
>>
>>I have to admit this--I don't know anything
>
>about the state dinner. All I know is
>when
>>Mao visted the USSR after the formation of
>>the People's Republic of China (zhong hua
>>ren min gong he guo), he felt humiliated
>and
>>even told one of his aides that "all I am
>>doing here is eat, sleep and eat"
>
>The history goes like this:
>
>When Mao went to Moscow after liberation,
>he was not
>treated very well.He was kept in a
>government rest
>house , and for three days ,Stalin didn't
>meet him,
>nor he was accorded any state-honor.
>Virtually, Stalin
>treated him like a commander of his own
>country.
>
>Then, the western media reported that Mao
>was kidnapped
>in Moscow.Because there was no news about
>Mao after
>he reached there.To counter the western
>report, Mao
>was interview by Russian TV.I suppose that
>is where
>he said the words you wrote.
>
>Then Stalin organized the official honor for
>him, and
>then there was this state dinner I talked
>about.
OK, thanks for informing me about the state dinner. But Mao didn;t think that highly of Deng. What about the "gang of four" (some even go as far to say, it should be called the "gang of Five" because chairman mao was the fifth person) which allied with Lin Biao and purged many senior , loyal officers, sent liu shaoqi to a death camp and sent Deng Xiaoping to learn from the peasants.
Also, you forgot to mention about the "forced" self criticism metings in which people were forced to write their self criticisms and which were later used to blackmail people.
Even Zhou was forced to write a self criticism of himself regarding the Shanghai Wu Hao net and Chairman Mao, didn;t do anything to stop the gang of four. Whether he was too weak to handle the gang or was himself the fifth member remains a debate--and its that gang who purged Deng. Now how can you say, that Mao liked Deng?
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 30-Oct-00 11:56 AM
>>
well, to me it seems you ae either mis-informed about the Chinese History or you just seem to
believe in whatever the CCP says. I studied CHinese studies in a college here, and was exposed to
various events which I am sure you didn't get to do while studying in Fang Da (Textile
University).
But don't think I am trying to undermine your position in this discussion. All i am saying is what
I know was taught to me in school by Chinese and American profs, and I don't think they taught me
anything wrong.
Trailokyaji::
1.You have been taking me as a person who believe in
what CCP says.Wrong! I was penalized in Fang Da for my
political opinion, for the whole four years, I was not
given my deserved yidengjiang(first prize) because
I fearlessly spoke the evil of CCP in school.Almost
Every Nepali student there in that period probably
knows this.
But it is not my idea to have bias against any party
or system just because it have been unfair to me.What
I repeatedly tried to understand is what people think
about their government there.
I always said this is a subjective issue. Chinese
history is inherently an amorphous, with no clear
shape to define its trend, with leaders capricious
enough not to fit in a model.To understand Chinese
history, I just don't need to enroll in American
college.
An intermittent visitor to Shanghai Church in Holiday
Inn near Jiaoda, I have met several disgruntled
religious persons.I have met several professors who
didn't spoke highly of CCP.But along with them,
I also talked to people who lived in the lower rung
of the ladder,who are concerned that their danwei is
leaving them.I have my own share of dissidents and
proCCP people in my long stay there.
The conclusion is: the way you understood China is
probably not more realistic than the way I understood
it.Shuttling between Hongkong, China and Nepal in my
long stay there, I have pretty much access to the books
banned there, to the views of dissidents that are not
allowed in Shanghai.My thoughts about CCP are based on
all what I saw.It is not necessary that our views
should converge.
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