| Username |
Post |
| HURPEC NEPAL |
Posted
on 15-Oct-01 10:21 AM
Human Rights and Peace Campaign (HURPEC) Nepal
(Operating HURPEC INTERNATIONAL NETWORK)
Central Office, GPO Box- 21405, Kathmandu, Nepal
(Estd. 10 Dec. 1998)
Our Declaration on 'Royal Massacre in Nepal'
About the horrific and terrible Royal Palace Massacre which took place at the Narayanhity Royal Palace of Nepal at the night of 1 June 2001; the Human Rights and Peace Campaign (HURPEC) Nepal believes and so declares that the Massacre was not done by the than Crown Prince Dipendra but it was the dangerous conspiracy occured by the National Conspirators with the help of International Powers to remove whole family of the past King and take new one on the thrown. This Declaration is made by HURPEC Nepal after complete study of all the circumstances and reports about the Massacre.
HURPEC NEPAL also declares that the Report of the so-called Probe Commission headed by Chief-Justice Keshav Prashad Upadhya and followed by Speaker of Parliament Taranath Ranabhat was taken to put the dust on the eyes of the people of Nepal and all around the world proving falsly that the late Dipendra was responsible for the Massacre.
HURPEC NEPAL is running it's deep study and investigation upon the Massacre and it will publish the whole report soon.
At last but not least, HURPEC NEPAL request and appeal all Nepalese Brothers and Sisters including International Communities to take an immediate action to find out the Conspirators and murderers of the late Royal Family by demanding the International Standard Investigation Commission and raising this issue through out the world.
For more information, we invite you to our web-site: http://www.hurpec.org/royalmassacre/
Thanks.
Milan Karki
President
Date: 10 October, 2001
|
| ashu |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 07:01 AM
Dear Milan,
It's one thing to reach conclusions by declaring something, and it's another thing altogether to PROVE it as such. As a human rights activist, you surely know this better than I do.
So far, your site gives NO proof as to why your declaration on this matter is really trustworthy.
Looking forward to reading evidence that support your conclusion on this matter.
Until then, you surely know not to pass your own beliefs as proofs.
oohi
ashu
ktm,nepal
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| Milan Karki |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 09:27 AM
Dear Ashu
I don't want to say that you are completely wrong, however as we, the HURPEC NEPAL is working on the issue of Royal Massacre from beginning and after long time of our study, we are reached on conclusion that the horrific tragedy of our country who assasinated all our than Royal Family and other senior members, is the dangerous conspiracy. About the evidence, we are on the way to publish it on our web-site in future.
That's all now.
YOur's
Milan Karki
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| MLS |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 10:18 AM
Hi Milanji,
I am interested to know about the nature, methods and experts used in your study to bring the eveidence-based truth out.
MLS
|
| Milan Karki |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 10:32 AM
Hi Friend
I already told that We will publish all report including our methods of investigation upon the Royal Massacre in future. What we declared is our conclustion on the Royal Massacre, and we have made this conclusion after deep investigation and study. And as our Investigation report may not be acceptable for everyone and perfect too, We are demanding for the formation of 'International Standard Investigation Commission' for the deep investigation of the Tragedy which is most important.
Let you know that late Dipendra was cever responsible for the Massacre, and those who are responsible will be taken on the light and punished by the boots of Nepalese People.
I request you to join on the campaign to find out the murderer of our Royal Family which has demaged our Nation throughout the world.
This another Kot Massacre will not be acceptable for the Nepalese people like in past.
Your's
Milan Karki
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 10:47 AM
Dear Milanji:
Some questions.
How come you declare this result , and not reveal the proof? Why do you think
Nepali citizens should believe you and not Ranabhat report? What's guarantee that
this is not another gimmick put forward by one obscure(sorry about the word)
human right organization to rivet public attention?
Please kindly publish your report first, as others did, and challenge others to prove
that wrong. I, as other also said, find no proof in your website.
And I believe people are more interested in your report than conclusion. At least,
I think, Ranabhat report didn't give us any conclusion, but a vague study of
reasons leading to the massacre, and a description of massacre site. You seem
to rush to declaring result, but that too by withholding evidence leading to the
result.
|
| MLS |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 11:47 AM
Hi Milan Ji,
I somehow getting the notion that HURPEC is a detective/ criminal investigation agency than working for the human rights or making peace.
If you are so confident in your investigation why are you demanding for another "international" thingy.
MLS
|
| Gandhi |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 12:26 PM
Milanji
Where is your complete report? Until and unless you provide your investigation methodology (including the credibility of the investigators and so on) and support your every statement by evidences, how can we believe what your conclusion is?
In your statement you have mentioned that your study is underway and you are also demanding an international standard investigation. Unless you are, for yourself, sure of the outcome of the investigation, how can you declare that it is a conspiracy? It is not a question of making fool of innocent people by telling that "from our reliable source" and give all the hypothetical (mangadhante) points to support your ideas.
Unless you give enough evidence, there is no difference between your organization and an illiterate person in the rural hills who would say "pakkai pani thulo shadyantra bhayeko chha, natra bhane tetra raja jasta manchhelai kasle marna sakchha?" I remember how we would talk among our fellow friends when we were 6 or 7 years old little kid "yo rukhma ta raja matrai chadna sakchhan hai?" (when we could not ourselves climb a big tree). This seems the same childhood mentality that a king has superpower and there is no ordinary human's feeling inside the king, queen or crown prince.
Gandhi
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| NK |
Posted
on 16-Oct-01 12:30 PM
It never ceases to amaze me how people like to discredit themselves again and again and ....
|
| ashu |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:03 AM
>It never ceases to amaze me how people like
>to discredit themselves again and again and .
>...
On the contrary, one can admire and respect the compassion
that Nepali human rights activists display.
It's just that IT IS TIME the the rest of us told Nepali human rights
activists-- without, of course, disrespecting their sense of
compassion -- that THAT compassion needs to be tempered
by boring but necessary stuff such as logic, evidence and
the process of well-supported reasoning.
That way, even if we find the conclusions disagreeable, at least
we will know how the reasoning process went.
Sure, strident emotionalism might have worked in the past for human rights
issues in Nepal: but, reasonable Nepalis all over the world have every
right to demand and deserve well-supported arguments, and NOT
conclusions based on beliefs and opinions.
If the conclusions are Milan's personal ones, then I can live with that -- even
when I find them disagreeable.
But when he dresses them up, as he apparently does here, in the garb of human rights issues, then, he needs to do a lot more work than whet he is doing here.
oohi
"a friend of human rights activists but an enemy of muddled thoughts"
ashu
ktm,nepal
|
| Himani |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:15 AM
Ashu,
Are you over that poem yet? Seem like you are not. You started to make me really sick.
|
| VillageVoice |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:20 AM
Dear Milanji:
Why should we believe that this isn't a cheap publicity stunt by HURPEC? Who are behind the investigation?
I also can't help questioning the timing of your unfounded claims: the high stakes govt-Maoists talks are just round the corner, the Sept 11 carnage in US, and now the anthrax scare, have changed the way the world we live in forever. Nations, and neighbors, are getting suspicous of each other.
Now the burden lies on you to prove your claims, or else you would have done a great damage to HURPEC's credibility.
|
| Kris |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:21 AM
ashu,
when NK says
>It never ceases to amaze me how people like
>to discredit themselves again and again and .
>...
you say "On the contrary, one can admire and respect the compassion
that Nepali human rights activists display... "
Now, it never ceases to amaze me as well how people like to discredit themselves again and again... Why? Even a Harvard educated person feels a need to assert himself again and again. How? I'm sure any person who knows english knows that "on the contrary" means "you are wrong". Now instead of "on the contrary" you could have used "In addition", which would go fine without anyone feeling a need to defend themselves.
I don't see how NK is wrong when she is amazed by how people act again and again. It's her mind, why don't you let her be amazed by what she gets amazed at; instead of telling her it's wrong for her to be amazed by this and that.
You need to come down from the pedestal where you imagine yourself to be and respect the commoners which is everybody else.
|
| ashu |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:25 AM
Dear Himani,
I do not know what poem you are referring to.
I assume you meant Namita's THAT one.
If so, the answer is: Yes.
On a larger note, my reference to "muddled thoughts" IN ANOTHER CONTEXT, as it here, need not trigger bad memories for you. If it does, then, maybe YOU are the one haven't gotten over that poem yourself :-)
If you are sick, the right thing to do is visit a doctor -- but you know this
already.
A very Happy Dassain to you.
oohi
ashu
ktm,nepal
|
| ashu |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:31 AM
Dear Kris-ji,
NK believes A.
I believe B.
There IS room for both of our thoughts here, and let us celebrate that.
I never even said that NK is wrong.
Of course, if you want to interpret my the content of my posting to suit your particular beliefs about Ashutosh Tiwari, well, what can I say except wish you a
happy Dassain and await a response from Milan-ji.
oohi
ashu
ktm,nepal
|
| Kris |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:41 AM
>Dear Kris-ji,
>
>NK believes A.
>I believe B.
>
BUT, when you say "on the contrary, I believe B" you're saying A is wrong and B is right and what you believe in.
Happy Dasain to you as well.
|
| GP |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 01:54 AM
If truth is blurred, Ashu can believe B, while NK believes on A. whats wrong?
GP
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| Kris |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 02:04 AM
GP, you're taking it out of context again here.
If you say - "This is what I think is right"
and Ashu says - "on the contrary, this is what I think"
maybe he's just blatantly self indulging egoist who thinks by default he knows everything and noone else knows anything.
by saying that is he not saying you're wrong and he's right? If that's alright by you, your definition of reality is definitely blurred. What happened to your sense of respect?
|
| GP |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 02:12 AM
Bro. Kris, have fun. Happy Bijaya Dashami.
GP
|
| ashu |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 03:24 AM
>maybe he's just blatantly self indulging
>egoist who thinks by default he knows
>everything and noone else knows anything.
Dear Kris,
OK.
For the sake of this thought process, let us assume that I am indeed, as you said, some "blatantly self-indulging egoist".
Even if that's true, so what?
What's that got to do with Milan's HURPEC and his "royal massacre" theory?
Does your calling me XYZ mean that I have to call you something equally colorful?
No.
Does this mean that you are some peer-respected social psychologist able to figure out personality types of people you encounter on the Net?
No.
Does that mean that you know me well as a person?
No.
Does this mean anything worthwhile?
No.
So?
Look, unless NK has specifically deputed you as her personal agent on this site, let us honor her own intelligence by saying that she is perfectly capable of defending her thoughts, if need be, without your twisting my arguments to DIGRESS from the thrust of this thread.
A very happy Dassain to you.
oohi
ashu
ktm,nepal
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| Milan Karki |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 09:51 AM
Dear Friends,
Namaste and Happy VIJAYA DASHAMI 2058 !
I appreciate all your coments and always welcome too. The Issue I raised and the Declaration we made on behalf of HURPEC NEPAL is raised to fight against those responsible for the Royal Massacre who are thinking to be saved blaming everything to that person who is also assasinated. What do you think ? Tell me. Do you believe that late Dipendra was responsible for the Massacre ? I have met thousands of Nepalese and foreigners who never believe that Dipendra was responsible.
What do you think about the report of the so-called Probe Commission ? Do you believe on every words of the report ? What the beautiful tale is written on the report to hide the truth and make late Dipendra murderer. Another matter, the report is the news report made by one general journalist. What do you think about it ???
You may ask now that what our report is ? We have made our report on the base of our deep study of the case. You everyone want the detail report now ? Yes, but I already told you that we will publish our report on our site later. We will do it. We have made our declaration on the ground of the truth and evidences. What appeal I made on 3 June (you can get it on our site: www.hurpec.org/royalmassacre/) and we are working on this case since that time. We had sent this appeal to all our Nepalese Brothers and Sisters through out the world.
What do you think ? As the September 11 events came now, and our Nation's case will be hidden on the shadow ? No ! Never !! Let you know that the Sept. 11 event is not smaller than our event of 1 June. And as the United States is hunting those responsible for the September 11 Attack, and same as you know that some one is also hunting those responsible for June 1 Massacre of our Nation. And the truth of the Massacre will come on light in future. And those responsible will be punished anyway. Time will come for justice.
I, as the president of HURPEC, again claim and announce that on the ground of our study, the Massacre was a dangerous conspiracy and we all who are fighting to find the truth be aware from other massacres.
About the question of International Investigation Commission, we have demanded from the beginning and we again tell that it must be formed and the Event of 1 June must be investigated by them. You may ask that HURPEC has done study and why need another Commission is required ? Because you all do not believe on our investigation. Because, our report may not be taken as authentic by Nepal's Government and UN. So, we need International Investigation commission. More than 75% Nepalese do not believe on the report of so-called probe Commission. So, we need another Investigation Commission to find out those responsible behind the Massacre.
That's all now. And I welcome any other comments and questions.
Your's
Milan Karki
|
| nobody |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 11:01 AM
Just borrowing something from another discussion. "the" best is incorrect? If I remember my grammar correctly, "the" is used before superlative adjectives. "On the contrary", people can believe what they want to believe, right to one's opinions!
:)
BTW, 185K for a house in Nepal sounds fair to me (after seeing the property and with 2 ropanis of land). Why do you care how the house was made or how it was earned? Nobody's forcing anyone to buy it. And if you want to pay tax on only 8000 of the 85000 you'll collect for rent, you have that option too. Is it a case of world is a reflection of inner self and all that? That posting is for "Property on Sale" not for "People Judge Me"!
Why the bull about the poverty line? So I live in a place where lots of people live below poverty line doesn't mean I have to be their Godfather and not enjoy my possessions while people living in the captitalist countries can enjoy theirs and bitch about my lack of conscience at the same time. After all, isn't that why we are here (US) in the first place, reap the benefits of capitalism? Hell if I had the same opportunities what do I care where I am?
If you think 185K in Nepal is a lot, you still pay what you pay in US for a lot of the items and compare the two economy. In fact people can afford a lot more in Nepal. e.g. all the DrMartens on the feet of the teenagers! It costs the same over here as there. And you probably see more of them in Kathmandu than in Boston. It's for the people who can afford...
|
| NK |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 11:11 AM
What does "on the contrary" mean? does it have a different meaning than what we have learned so far? Is it Bill Clinton's "it depends what you mean by 'IS'?" When Ashu writes beginning his sentence with the "on the contrary" and goes on to support what he contradicted before then what does one ifer from that?
And Ashu, please let's not personalize the posters or postings here, shall we? If some Kris wrote what he saw as a contradiction in your writing then that's what he saw. the posting is the evidence. Just go back and read. I don't have to "specifically" ask him to be my deputy. please go on writing on this writing and on and on and on - anybody out there ...... it never ceases to amaze me........................
|
| nobody |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 11:21 AM
"Ambivalent"?
|
| GP |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 07:41 PM
Ashu wrote:
Look, unless NK has specifically deputed you as her personal agent on this site,
...
--
When I read this first part, i could not digest, why he add to make
pizza here ?
I guess Ashu made this part mistakenly, but, if it is his deliberate
attempt to discredit NK's previous posting by mixing it with
Kris, then, Ashu is wrong. Instead of validating his statement
(this first part) its better to confess it as mistake, and if he
tries to validate, then, its deliberate.
GP
|
| GP |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 07:53 PM
Ashu wrote:
Look, unless NK has specifically deputed you as her personal agent on this site,
...
------
Ashu wrote sometime back on someone's reply that (nearly = to)
"its feminists they taught us that PERSONAL IS POLITICAL",
if I remember it correctly. Is not the above statement too
political, I mean personal. And, what happened to the old
motto in old golden SCN days:... "Reject ideas not person" ?
Did I miss something? Correct me.
GP
|
| shabnam |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 08:18 PM
Kris, that's typical Ashutosh Tiwari strategy for you! He will go on to personalize you, belittle you in subtle ways that makes good-faith people like GPji think it's just a simple mistake. When confronted, he will begin his bemoaning about people attacking him, calling himself a victim and then posting his self-pitying personal emails.
When Kris thinks Ashu is a "blatantly self-indulging egoist", it his personal opinion. Then Ashu, the great respecter of personal opinion and disagreements, comes around and reasons it to be a meaningless statement, apparently something that doesn't bother him the least.
Well, well! If that is so, why, oh why, does Ashu go to length to reduce Kris's personal opinions, ultimately calling him an agent (in other words a chamcha)!!
On the contrary (and I mean it), Ashu, the blatantly self-indulging egoist, can't take the fact that Kris, a commoner, could dare to correct him, a Harvard educated, super-enlightened, superior form of life.
Just my personal opinions, something that is sure to bother Ashu the least!
Happy Dashain everyone.
|
| Ashu's bajee |
Posted
on 17-Oct-01 10:30 PM
I never thought i had a grand son called Ashu...... I am so amazed and sad by what he has become today...... His dad chose a right name for him.... He is full od Ashu, and that is why he has to speak for everybody in this forum thinking that he is the most intellegent person on earth.... I thought Harvard graduates were better than the standard that Ashu has shown..... This web-site is not made for you only.... so don't write if you feel like you cannot contribute anything to the topic of discussion.... you just offend people by doing that.................
Tero Bajee
|
| somerville |
Posted
on 18-Oct-01 03:01 AM
i don't understand why everyone is ganging up on ashutosh. how come everyone is allowed to speak their mind but when he deos, it is always taken in a negative perspective. I know some of you will reply to this mail by saying I don't know how ashu is and what he has done to people, but let me clarify something. i do know who he is and also know how stubborn at times he can be. but hey that's just his nature so accept it. there's no need to bash him up by being immature, because let's face it, he is a very intellectual person, and knows what he's talking about. At his age he has gone to places others dream of going (example london, BBC). I am not sure but i think certain people are envious of his success, and cannot digest it. and i know i will receive mails denying this point too. anyway, just to let you guys know i am not ashu bhakta or anything else, but just an observer who is well aware of his dislikeness in the nepalese community. However, it is time to grow up people, and admire other nepalese for their works and achievements instead of bashing him/her up. If we keep on going like this, nepal nor its people will never prosper.
happy dasain
|
| ashu |
Posted
on 18-Oct-01 03:59 AM
Dear "somerville"
I myself enjoyed your sneaky defense!!
The hallmarks of who wrote it are clear to
me as they should be others in the know :-)
It's a small world, after all.
And that is OK.
Just so you know, I do NOT mind anonymous attackers with ridiculous charges ganging up on me now and then. So, your defense is NOT something I need though you are free to post it, that too, under an anonymous tag!!
My best defense continues to be simple: just be myself, and live with that, come hell or high water. :-)
I mean, what ELSE can these attackers really do? They cannot -- like Biswo, Gandhi, Trialokya and others openly disagree with me with their own ideas and without calling me names.
And that's because these people have NO ideas, all they have are reptilian anger and personal resentment. I mean, even when people like Village Voice and Sparsha and other fake-name wallahs disagree with me, I have noticed that they CONSISTEENTLY emphasize on disagreements based on ideas and NOT on personalities -- and I like that. It's these people and others who can be counted to take the level of discussions upward and forward here -- NOT the mindless attackers of Ashutosh Tiwari.
And so, because these anonymous personal attacks are INHERENTLY false and shallow, I have noticed that the people behind them -- no matter how anonymous they tey to be -- simply cannot sustain themselves over a long haul, and this fact drives them, I can imagine, crazy and crazy.
If I were to make a list of the names of these anonymous attackers, there would be a long list . . . and that's life.
oohi
ashu
ktm,nepal
|
| nemesis |
Posted
on 20-Oct-01 10:45 PM
>Does this mean that you are some peer-respected social psychologist able to
> figure out personality types of people you encounter on the Net?
>
>No.
One does not need to be a peer-respected social psychologist (why social anway?) to figure you out. It is pretty obvious that you just love to hear yourself talk (or as the case is, read yourself write).
If speaking is silver, and silence is gold, than your bulshit is only worth some nickel.
Your Nemesis
|
| nemesis |
Posted
on 20-Oct-01 11:04 PM
Even the thought of blaming the tragedy around the Royal Nepal familly on a conspiracy is appauling, and bares the horrible events of any dignity.
But then maybe HUPREC just wanted to enjoy some publicity. Well done in that respect, only that the idea [of a conspiracy] is as old as the mummies (Oh Bother, this is something you don't have in Nepal....)
Your Nemesis
|
