| Username |
Post |
| Suman Dhakal |
Posted
on 29-Jun-02 11:46 PM
Shri man gumbhira nepali prachanda pratapi bhupati
Shri pach sarkar maharajadhiraja ko sada rahos unnati
Rakhun chi rayu eeshale praja phailiyos pukaraun jaya premale
Hami nepali sarale.
May glory crown you, courageous Sovereign,
You, the gallant Nepalese,
Shri Pansh Maharajadhiraja, our glorious ruler,
May he live for many years to come
And may the number of his subjects increase.
Let every Nepalese sing this with joy. (http://www.copcity.com/anthems/nepal.html)
Today I was thinking of these above lines, our national anthem. Above is the rough translation of our national anthem. It does nothing but glorify the king. "shri panch maharaj dhiraj ko sadha rahos unnati". I think we all are aware now that sarkar's unnati is not tied with the unnati of the country. Yet we go on singing this song as if he is bigger than the country itself.
Maybe back in 1899 when the national anthem was adopted it was a popular beilef that "raja ko valai ma nai desh ko valai cha". I think I speak for the majority of us when I say that the above line is no longer the popular belief. How about "desh ko unnati" insted of maharaj dhiraj ko unnati. Why even continue to praise the kings when they have become less important in our lives?
Please post your thoughts on this.
Suman Dhakal
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| Parakhi |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 12:07 AM
I don't know what Chakrapani Chalise was feeling when he wrote this. This song could be a perfect fit to please the rulers then. I have not sung this by heart for the last 15 or more years when I deeply realized the meaning in that song. There is no harm to with a good luck for the king. However,it does not fit in right context. If King were thought to be incarnation of god "Bhagawan Bishnu" why on the earth do we need to pray for his "Sada Rahos Unnati"?
Aru ke bhannu....?
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| ? |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 12:20 AM
The anthem would have perfect for say when absolute monarchy reigned (pre french revolution). Dont you get it, no wonder we are underdeveloped.
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| Paschim |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 09:38 AM
The Story of Our National Anthem
Suman-ji, very interesting discussion you’ve begun. I’ve been giving some thought to this topic privately and publicly for the past 11 years. First, let me share my private findings on Sajha:
Two men who stand out for their eccentricities, exploits, power, length of reign, and accidental goodness during the Rana years (1846 to 1950) are Jung Bahadur and Chandra Shumsher. Jung Bahadur knew the British, who had by 1857 swallowed the mighty sub-continent of India, had to be pleased if they were to be undisturbed in ruling the swathe of the Central Himalaya. He pleased them by supplying young Nepali men to fight the White man’s imperial wars. What Jung began, Chandra consolidated.
What is most interesting though is that Nepal had no official national anthem until 1923 when the kingdom received some sort of recognition from the British. “God Save the King”, the English national anthem, was played in Nepali ceremonies but no one knew what that meant and even if they knew no one challenged that it was quite inappropriate to play a foreign national anthem just for the sake of it. It is said that once the tune was played, no matter what anyone was doing, one had to stand up and pay respect to the "dhoon". The resident British Ambassador was said to be particularly upset about the random playing of “God Save the King” on Nepali soil.
After this custom of blind copying became embarrassingly obvious, Ram Mani Acharya Dixit, advisor to Chandra Shumsher, and from whose "Purana Samjhana" I have extracted some of this information, suggested to him that a Nepali anthem had to be composed. Chandra agreed, and Dixit hired as Consultant his good friend, Chakrapani Chalise to come up with the words. This was in 1981 BS, circa 1925 AD. Dixit gave Chalise broad guidelines leaving the rest to the Pundit’s own creativity. Dixit’s suggestion was to have two verses praising the greatness, goodness and the grandness of His Majesty the King and His Excellency the Prime Minister.
For the king, the words were to reflect the following: we felicitate the king of the Nepal kingdom, home of the brave Gorkha race, controlled by pure ksetriyas. The Prime Minister’s verse was also flamboyant, but less so than the king’s.
Chandra Shumsher had hired an Indian gentlemen called Mr. M. A. Pathan from Bikaner, Rajasthan as the Band Master for Nepal. So it was the Indian Mr. Pathan who put music into Chalise’s words. Thus was born the infamous “Sriman Gambhir”. I think, their violent tactics aside, the Maoists are right to pressure this anthem's dis-use today.
--------
On a public note, I published a detailed article long before the present batch of Maoist criminals were born, 11 years ago actually, in Saptahik Bimarsha (now infamous for partisan interests, but then it was Nepal’s most famous and most widely-read weekly) saying the national anthem had to be changed in the new democratic context. The title of my piece was "Yesto Rastriya Gaan Kahile Samma?" I’d analyzed the words and argued why the expressions were anachronistic. This article was most favorably received. I was still at high school when I wrote that, and was rather flattered when Modanath Prashrit, the famous leftist scribe (who I hear has also disgraced himself in recent years politically) endorsed my writing in an interesting letter to the editor of Bimarsha (published in a subsequent issue).
Sorry I can’t recall the exact dates and reproduce the text of my article now, but if people have access to Bimarsha archives from 11 years ago, circa 1991, they can dig it up. If something had been done on this topic during that time, and especially when the Constitution was being drafted, then this embarrassing anthem could have been changed for good. But with the resurrection of reactionaries and moral weakening of yesterday’s progressive democrats, we might have lost the chance for now.
I was actually rather disgusted this afternoon when I watched an NTV clip on King Gyanendra’s return from India on nepalnews.com. All that orchestrated “jaya jayakar” along the road from the airport was so distasteful that I think a self-respecting monarch would be the first one to get rid of this ridiculous culture of sycophancy in Nepal. I wish His Majesty surfed Sajha.com and saw this frank but honest appeal from his citizens.
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| Biswo |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 11:37 AM
Sumanji,
Your objection is not misplaced, and the national anthem, first written by Chakra
Pani Chalise, and composed in today's form by Bakhatbir Budhapirthi,has a lot
of exceptionable words.It effectively reduces Nepali citizens to Raiti.It was probably
OK at the time when Nepal was under the harsh repressive regime of Ranas,
and people were more deferential to the king, but now the sooner the kings
realise they are equal to us the better it is going to be for them.
Kabibar Madhav Ghimire's "Gauchha Geet Nepali, Jyoti Ko Pankha Uchaali" was
once floated to be the national anthem. The song praises our ancestors, and
their bravery. I don't think it has any word for the king either.It would have
been a lot better option.
--
I once figured out that Chadra Shamsher was awarded honorary PhD in civil law
by Oxford University. What a candidate they got for that degree!!
Paschim, btw, I heard some where that Bir Shamsher refused to go to England
because they were not willing to give him 21-top ko salami that Janga Bdr
received. Chandra Shamsher said " I don't mind",even 'his highness' address,
and sailed away to England for the trip. And despite giving equal status of
Holland and Afganistan to Nepal in 1903 coronation of the king, despite
changing status of British Representative in Nepal to the status of
Envoy in 1923, England waited until the death of Chandra Shamsher ,
in 1934, to formally recognize Nepal as sovereign country.
I think Chandra Shamsher was the worst of the Rana ministers. He genuflected
all he could to appease British govts. He sent all our youths to the
war of British imperialists in Europe in First World War, even before
they asked for that. For him, blood of Nepali people was worth nothing.
(Incidentally, he also gave an assistance of 1 million pound to the
British Regime at the first world war, acc to history books)
The most unfortunate thing is , Chandra Shamsher remained in the pshche
of our politicans as a guiding star. Kick anyone , even brother, who wants to
do good to Nepali people, do whatever you want to make yourself acceptable
to foreign powers, and consolidate your power whenever you can,and disregard
the blood of common Nepalese people if that helps you to stay in power.An
estimated 20% of Nepai adults were involved in the first world war that
wasn't ours.
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| Satya |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 12:03 PM
Dear Suman Dhakalji,
The world has not changed basically, specially Nepal. We are still being ruled by morden Ranas in the name of democracy. So called rastriya gaan is raj gaan. Our national day is king's birthday. etc.........
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| manashalu |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 12:58 PM
Yeah, national anthem should raise our feeling of self-pride of being a nepali citizen, it should represent patriotic feeling of nepalese hearts, but till now I have found that no nepalese I met have praised about our national anthem. After the restoration of democracy of many schools stopped to sing 'shreeman gambhir...'had begun to sing 'gaunchha geet nepali...' as a national anthem.
Later, It was disappointing news that no change was made in our national anthem when 'new' constituition was adopted. At that time, there was huge 'bahas' about our national anthem in nepalese media and I had also read modnath's articles(I was regular reader of bimarsha saptahik at that time). I did not understand our interim government had what kind of 'bibashata' not to change our national anthem at that time. I was also the disappointed one because of no change in our national anthem.
After the restoration of democracy, many schools stopped to sing this national anthem(mainly in maoist areas, in my schools also because most of teachers were close to maobadis) and later discourage to continue this national anthem also became one of the main 'abhiyan' of maoists in their 'peoples war'. Anyway, I feel that 'gaunchha geet...' is far better than 'shreeman...' It does not live in my heart although I used to sing it everyday for ten year school periods.
When Janga bahadur met sons of dhir shamsher, he found that chandra shamsher was litlle bit different in nature than to other brothers. He was a very shy child and othres laughed at him. At that time, janga bahadur commented about him "don't underestimate this child, this child will become very clever ruler one day" . I think chandra shamsher proved it being one of the most(infamous) 'successful' rana primeministers.
In 'jelma 20 barsha' book by khadga man singh, It is written that: rana sashak harule nepalilai jati sakdo atyachar ra soshan garne karya gare, tyasma sichit nirankush(educated but autocratic) sashak ajha safal hun sakchhan bhanne kura chandra samsher(who is the first matric grduated in nepal)le pramanit gareka chhan."
I don't know it can be also applied to or not about the 'political insincerity' of our present day leaders ???
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| Suman bro ko saathi |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 01:41 PM
Hey suman bro, thanks for bringing up this topic. I have few things to say. My question is, are we going to continue with this national anthem when Paras becomes the king? Are all Nepali supposed to sing for Paras' unnati day in and day out? First of all, he is not even fit to be the king. He is worse than an average human being and yet we are to go on praising him? Give me a break.
What have the kings done to deserve such a praise? I feel that we do not even need the king. I say that we should immediatly do away with the national anthem. If we our people have not realized the irrelavance of such an anthem and do nothing about it then I see a bleak future ahead for us. Changing the naitonal anthem may not solve our problems over night, but it will be a good step towards a change that is so despretly needed. I think it is our nature of holding on to the past and and our unwillingnes to take some bold steps is what is holding us back. If we are to make any progress as a nation then some dramatic changes are necessary. Its about time we show some guts. Doing away with this outdated anthem will be a big step for us Nepali. And this shall be the opening of a door for future changes. Let push come to a shove.
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| Biswo |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 02:39 PM
I wrote a long posting in reply of Manashaluji's posting re Ranas. For some reason,
the site says it contained some 'banned words' and it not only rejected the posting,
it was lost.
I am too heartbroken to write that stuff again. I should have saved it, buhuhu.
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| Paschim |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 09:18 PM
Okay, this is really annoying. I also just tried to post some thoughts, and like Biswo, said the forum wouldn't accept my posting because it says it contains some banned words.
San, how do we know which words are banned? I re-read what I wrote and I can spot no such thing. Can you please create a section where one can see what some of those objectionable words are, or at least email them to me if it's publicly undisclosable? It's really irritating to write something spontaneously and not be able to post. Thanks.
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| Paschim |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 10:39 PM
While they lack the poetic grace of Madhav Ghimire's verses, I was also impressed with some of Gopal Yonzan's musical scores. I recently bought his CD, "Nishani 53: Shradhanjali". It has some very good rastriya geets (but they fall short of qualifying for a national anthem in my opinion).
Biswo, I have no idea about Bir Shumsher's refused trip to England. Knowing how badly all Rana rulers craved recognition from their White Sahibs, I am not so sure if his grounds for refusal were so benign. But I have long been fascinated by Jung Bahadur's rise to power and of course his one year long visit to Europe in 1850. Both in England and France, Jung was accorded a bemused welcome by his hosts. His visit to England was also hailed as the "first visit of an Asian leader to Victorian England". Actually Jung attempted a little-known second visit to England in 1874. And this time he took with him *120* bodyguards. He cancelled the trip in Bombay where he fell off a horse and hurt himself.
On Chandra's honorary doctoral award at Oxford, yes it does sound absurd. We should not forget the context though. Oxford was very much a part of the colonial establishment that sought to expand the empire and reward allies with pomp. Many colonial civil servants were trained at Oxbridge. Chandra was a servile ally in a region that later became the "crown jewel" of the British Empire. Funny things happened then. Recall that Cecil Rhodes the colonist from today's Zimbabwe also bequeathed a fund at Oxford. Rather interesting that young, smart Americans today vie to win part of that money to attend Oxford as it is considered prestigious in the US. Bill Clinton attended University College, Oxford, on Rhodes, and he too was awarded the same doctoral degree in civil law that Chandra Shumsher received. If you watch this ceremony at Oxford's Sheldonian theatre, it's a weird sight. The whole pronouncement is made in Latin and except a handful of Latin scholars, no body including the recipient understands a single word of what is said. Clinton remarked in 1995, "as always, an American is half a step behind at Oxford."
Anyway, sorry to have digressed, but the larger point is: funny things happen at interesting times. And the age of the empire was at once funny and tragic.
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| Paschim |
Posted
on 30-Jun-02 11:10 PM
Oh, before I forget, one interesting factoid on Chandra's honorary degree from Oxford: when you are in Kathmandu next, visit the "Baber Mahal Revisited" complex. I think next to the *toilet* of the restaurant on the first floor, The Baithak, they have hung a copy of that Oxford degree. I think, but I'm not 100% sure. But there is definitely a fancy degree in English that Chandra received that's hung there. Next to the toilet, of all places. Now, that is funny. Reminds me of self-deprecating graffiti in toilets at the London School of Economics (LSE) where mischievous undergradutaes used to write next to the roll of toilet paper: LSE degree - please take one :)
Baber was of course Chandra's second son, Mohan Shumsher's brother, and the folks who have renovated that complex (formerly said to be a stable) are Baber's descendants. The real Baber Mahal was of course nationalized by Raja Mahendra.
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| manashalu |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 10:46 AM
I am sorry to biswo for losing his posting and at the same time feel regretted that I could not read his posting. About chandra shamsher, I wrote that he proved himself as a one of the( infamous) 'most successful' rana ruler. Here my meaning of 'successful' was 'to become most successful autocratic ruler' ,so I added 'infamous' word before it for no more confusion.
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| manashalu |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 11:13 AM
To paschim and biswo,
I request you to post your NEW stuffs(I mean NOT ALL) under USERGROUPS so that it will be easier to search your interesting posting. In KURAKANI column, there are altogether more than 1500 postings and sometimes so much time consuming to search your previous postings. It's just my suggestion.
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| Site Admin |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 11:54 AM
For easier access to postings from a registered user, please click on the username on the posting, then click on the 'Sajha Postings' Link.
Hopefully this will make it easier to find a registered users postings. The ban on some words could cause some problems if some nepali bad word strings are present in your posting although in a different context. The ban was created to inconvenience our esteemed posters, but to automate the checking of bad words in the content of the discussions, and to decrease the policing time required to filter out such words.
Regards.
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| my thought |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 01:38 PM
i think that whoever has a problema with the anthem should sit down and pen (lord knows they're prolific enough to write numerous sajha e-novellas) a new song. to fun it up a bit, there could be a spontaneous anthema composing session during the ANA convention later this week. just make sure to write in spanish, however, so all the "swadeshis" (latinos) don't feel left out. ;)
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| Biswo |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 02:47 PM
Yea, my thoughtji, people are opposing even Chakra Pani's (hudahuda even Madhav
Ghimire's) poem, and I am not so fool to think that my poem will be accepted as
national anthem:-)
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| NK |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 03:42 PM
I always wodered what the hell am I forced to singing this early in the morning. The "song" did not make any sense. I vaguely knew it had something to do with some "maharaja." Later on I just got used to mouthing this idiotic sounding national anthem and even forgot to wonder....
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| dodhare |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 04:00 PM
I oppose our national anthem coz I'm being asked to accept 2 different things. For example, our national anthem contradicts to family planning ad. How can I accept both? If we cannot change national anthem, let’s say NO to FAMILY PLANNING :) Most people seem to follow the later one anyway!
I'm not a poet, so please allow me to modify the existing lyrics written by Chamcha.pani Chalise. Added words are in CAPS and removed words are in paren().
Shri man gumbhira nepali prachanda pratapi bhupati
Shri pach.KO sarkar (maharajadhiraja) ko sada rahos unnati
Rakhun chi rayu eeshale JUNGLE :) (praja) phailiyos pukaraun jaya premale
Hami nepali bhaeesarale.
I'm also for Gauchha geet nepali by Madhav Pd. Ghimire!
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| Parakhi |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 04:24 PM
Gaunchha Gita Nepali
Jyotiko Pankha Uchali
Jaya Jaya Jaya He Nepal
Sundar Shanta Bishal
Sita le sara Bhijain Dakshina Lanka Bharat
Bhrikuti Tara Udain Uttar China Tibbat
Hamile Himal Uthayoun Asia Ko majhama
Savyata basa Basethyo Aayera Yehi Sanjhama
..................
................
...............
Kun Shakti ko Samuma Kahile Hami Jhuketheun?
Yehi Nepali Matoma Dilako Phoola Ropera
Yehi Pahadi Shilama Pritiko Geeta Khopera
Bachaunla Hami Nepal ma Chandra ra Surya Dhwoja Li
Nachaunla Hami Himalma Jyotiko Pankha Uchali
Kasto ramro rastriya geet...Nepali history le bhariyeko.. Nepali ko pride mathi uthaune khalko....Bichka kehi lain birsen, please someone fill that gap. I am behind this 100%..
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| doooooooooooodh! |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 04:42 PM
dodh-ster,
i can't BE-lieve you didn't take "prachanda" out of the first line! ;)
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| Biswo |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 04:50 PM
>Biswo, I have no idea about Bir Shumsher's refused trip to England. Knowing how
>badly all Rana rulers craved recognition from their White Sahibs, I am not so sure if
>his grounds for refusal were so benign.
Paschim, I read somewhere about this. The context was , however, a harsh criticism
of Chandra Shamsher. The writer was saying, even Bir Shamsher refused to go to
Britain without assured of getting 21 topko salaami, but Chandra went for 19 top
(or 17 top?) which was equal to what the king of Patiyala would get in his trip.
>I am sorry to biswo for losing his posting and at the same time feel regretted that
>I could not read his posting.
Manashaluji, thanks for your interest in my posting. Hey, others too got the problem,
but it is difficult to blame San, the man is trying to automate this process of filtering.
>Kasto ramro rastriya geet...Nepali history le bhariyeko.. Nepali ko pride mathi
>uthaune khalko....Bichka kehi lain birsen, please someone fill that gap. I am behind
>this 100%..
Hey, Parakhiji, that was sweet praise for the poem. I used to listen to the song sung
by Taradevi (and Natikaji ho?), and the song is also so good. If you had asked me to
fill these lines while I was in class 4, I could have definitely filled them. Now, it is
difficult:-)
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| manashalu |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 05:00 PM
_____________________________
Gaunchha Geet Nepali
Jyotiko Pankha Uchali
Jaya Jaya Jaya Nepal
Sundar Shanta Bishal
Gandaki, koshi, karnali, mechi ra mahakali
Lek ra besi bunjhaun chhin lahar lakhaun uchali
Himalchuli bolaunchha pahilo jhulka nikali
Sagarmatha shikharma pugdachha pahile nepali
Gaunchha geet.....
Sita le sara Bhijain Dakshina Lanka Bharat
Bhrikuti Tara Udain Uttar China Tibbat
Buddhale yanhi payethe gyanko pahilo muhan
Shivale yanhi layethe sristiko pahilo bihan
Gaunchha geet.......
Paschim killa kangda purvama tista pugethaun
Kun saktiko samuma kahile hami jhukethaun
Hamile Himal Uthayoun Asia Ko majhama
Savyata basa Basethyo Aayera Yehi Sanjhama
Gaunchha geet....
Yehi Nepali Matoma Dilako Phoola Ropera
Yehi Pahadi Shilama Pritiko Geeta Khopera
Bachaunla Hami Nepal ma Chandra ra Surya Dhwoja Li
Nachaunla Hami Himalma Jyotiko Pankha Uchali
Gaunchha geet....
_____________________________________________
MP3 of 'Gaunchha geet....' is available in in this link
******************************
http://musicnepal.com/download.htm
********************************
Gauncha geet Nepali...
(Various Artists, Album "Gauncha Geet Nepali )
some other good national songs:
Yo Nepali seer uchali..
(Various Artists, Album "Gauncha Geet Nepali )
yo nepali shir uchali sansarma lamkachha
junkiri jhai jyoti bali andhakarma chamkanchha
..........
_________________________
baneko chha paharale yo chhati mero
bageko chha chhahara ragatma mero
pakheruma khelne, takurama khelne
ma jhukdai najhukne nepalko chhoro
ma jhukdai najhukne nepalko chhoro
pokheko rotile mero pet bharinna
magiyeko dhotile mero laj chhopinna
.....
__________________________
deshle ragat mage malai bali chadau
rundinan meri aama uu nepalki chhori
.....
______________________
nepali haun nepali bhai sada sada rahaun
nepalmai falaun fulaun nepalmai maraun
.....
_______________________________________
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| khai ko |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 05:20 PM
> Baneko chha pahara le yo chhati mero ..<
Are you nuts to suggest this song for a national anthem? It's got the hell of mourning tunes !!
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| Paschim |
Posted
on 01-Jul-02 09:26 PM
I think the last few verses that Manashalu wrote are Gopal Yonzan's which I referred to earlier. Great rastriya geets, but I think unsuitable for a national anthem. I like Madhav Ghimire's "Jyoti ko Pankha Uchaali" as a song, but I am skeptic of over-doing our "purkha ko bravery" as well as the significance of marriages of Sita and Bhrikuti to gentlemen in neighboring countries well before Nepal existed in its present form.
Frankly, the hackneyed expression of "Tista dekhi Sutlej samma jiteko" is also quite inappropriate. We merely ruled that territory between 1802 and 1814, just for 12 years, and our control of those territories was marked by unbelievable brutality - one of the reasons why the local princes (taxed and suppressed heavily by the Gorkhalis) invited the British to defend them which all led to the Sugauli fiasco in 1816 when we lost all that was annexed for 12 years. When traveling in the Indian Himalayan region exactly a year ago last July - in Garhwal and Kumaon - I was told that some folk songs in that region *still* speak of Gorkha brutality. And when I enquired about Balbhadra's famous fort at Nalapani, nobody knew. It took me and my Sikh rickshaw driver a whole day to figure out where the site was - some 8 kilometers out of Dehradun, atop a hill. After a steep climb of 2 hours, with local help, I located the place, but there was no fort (just two boulders) and there was nothing that marked the historic battle and surrender of our forces there in 1815. All I found was a cemented block with (Balbhadra written on it) a trident, and a discarded saffron T-shirt. The carved stone that the British had left behind praising Balbhadra that I'd seen in photographs wasn't there. The sight was pathetic and I was deeply saddened. I call upon our *true* Nepali nationalists (not the jingoistic extreme communists or the farcical Raja-badi jokers) to show their desh-bhakti by start giving attention to real nationalist relics of substance such as the Balbhadra site in Nalapani, and not by beating up dark skinned folks in Baneshwor.
Anyway, I think if we are to find a new anthem, let's draft a new one. Let it speak of the classic achievements of the past, recognize the likes of Siddhartha Gautama et al., speak of our natural beauty, but let the tenor be people-focused speaking of what we embody and what our collective aspirations are for the future. No raja, sarkaar, or any samanti nonsense. Also when making it people-centric, none of that communist propaganda, too. Actually the Royal Nepal Academy organizes these big national poetry competitions every year. It's quite a prestigious event and the winning poetries are usually just great. Why not have a similar nationwide competition for a national anthem under the aegis of the Academy?
------------
Would have loved to be there at the DC ANA, and even recite a poem or two like in Philly, but sadly I'll have to miss it this year. But my kabi friend from Tehrathum, Tirtha Prasad Timsina, will be there. He won the second prize last year with a pidit love poem. This year, he informs me that his poem is to do with cyber-love. Chat-maya re. Well, I kindly request all Sajha-ites to please support this Socrates looking Kabi from the East. Thank you :)
|
| Biswo |
Posted
on 02-Jul-02 01:48 PM
Paschim,
I am not sure if I would dismiss "the significance of marriages of Sita and Bhrikuti to
gentlemen in neighboring countries well before Nepal existed in its present form."
One reason is because they were not just married off to foreign countries. A lot
of other princesses were married off subsequently, but no one could influence
their adopted country more than these ladies. Take Bhrikuti as example, Married
to a powerful , but heathen, Tibetan ruler Songtsen Gampo, she spreaded
Buddhism there, made Nepali style architecture as well as famous Jokhang Temple
which is still one of the most remarkable monument of Lhasa.(Note, while in Lhasa,
I had hard time telling people about Bhrikuti. Bhrikuti obviously was Nepali name.
I had learned somewhere that her name in Tibet was "Harittara", so I converted
it to "lu xing" and told to a couple of people. I failed, no one understood. It was
only near Jokhang Temple that people understood what I was talking about.)
We conquered Tibet later too, but not like Bhrikuti, she conquered the local hearts.
I don't know about Manisha Koirala, but no other Nepali seemed to have conquered
hearts of our other neighboring countries.
Sita was probably fictional. But Sita have more than just 'an ordinary devi's ' image.
Sita conquered the heart of Indians, and Indians were indebted to her, as could be
seen by influx of a lot of Indians to Janakpur, and it was traditionally this way.
In fact, the Indians used to come to Janakpur for a lot of purposes. The queen of
princely state of Orchha( Tehri, or Tikamgadh being its capital city) located in
present day Madhya Pradesh of India, Maharani Brikhabhanu Devi too came
here expecting a divine blessing for begetting a son ijn late 19th century.After
begetting a son, what she made in Janakpur was a mesmerizing monument of Janaki
Mandir!! Whether Sita was mythical or not, she deserves a thank for her influence
which ,at least, after centuries , was instrumental in providing in the hot, sqalid
town of Janakpur that beautiful temple.
So, I think I am not going to dismiss these ladies, specially since we really have dearth
of people who could transcend our border and influence other nations the way
these two did. Dissenting thought only!!
|
| manashalu |
Posted
on 02-Jul-02 02:40 PM
>>but I am skeptic of over-doing our "purkha ko bravery" as well as the significance of marriages of Sita and Bhrikuti to gentlemen in neighboring countries well before Nepal existed in its present form
>>Let it speak of the classic achievements of the past, recognize the likes of Siddhartha Gautama et
[In fact, Gautam Buddha(5~6 century BC )born earlier than Bhreekuti(4~5 century AD?)]
I think These lines are little bit contradictory, ki kaso Paschimji ?
Anyway, Sita, Bhreekuti and Gautam Buddha all born in soil of present day Nepal and I think we could be proud for them.
|
| Paschim |
Posted
on 02-Jul-02 09:38 PM
Biswo, interesting notes and points very well taken. Thank you. Of course it is a matter of pride that Bhrikuti and Sita are said to be born in a land that is present day Nepal. Inspirational stories, great women, and I think Nepali school curriculum should have stuff written on them. I was just expressing my skepticism on giving prominence to people in an ideally uncontroversial thing like the national anthem whose, i) record of historical existence, and ii) verification of lifetime achievements, are more *mythical* than *factual*. Perhaps slightly less true of Bhrikuti who I need to read up on a bit more on how exactly she spread Buddhism up North. So school children material? Yes, definitely. But national anthem material? I would think twice. And I write this with reluctance, because, hey, I'm a great fan of cool women wherever they can be found!
But you see, Manashalu-ji, unlike these two grand ladies, Gautama Buddha is a *historically verifiable* figure who just didn't "spread" Buddhism, but "created" it. Doubts about Buddha creating Buddhism are not as severe as those of to what degree Bhrikuti spread Buddhism. Buddha is "too big" a character to ignore and "too important" a legend to not claim as ours despite his birth in a land that wasn't geo-politically Nepal then. With the global recognition of Lumbini and the Ashoka pillar, his i) record of historical existence, and ii) verification of lifetime achievement, are both factual, not mythical.
On your gentle pointing out of that apparent contradiction, I was rather careful when I wrote "classic" achievements. By classic, I meant achievements that were first-rate and that stood the rigors of time. And here I want us to appreciate that an independent nation state called Nepal was created and whose independence was preserved without ever being colonised. But I want to downplay the "purkha ko bravery" part, although that "purkha ko bravery" might have played a role in preserving (and risking) our independence.
That we remained independent always is a classic achievement. But deeds that define our "purkha ko bravery" open an ugly closet - not only during the brief sway we held in Garhwal and Kumaon that I was writing about yesterday, but even during our own process of Unification - the Gorkhalis weren't exactly benign knights - their brutalities against ethnic groups in Kirant country as well as the Newars of Kathmandu, among others, are recorded in gruesome detail. But heck, despite these, we are proud that a country called Nepal was created and preserved out of an ad-hoc experiment in territorial expansionism. Do you see where I'm coming from?
So, for example, a line like:
"samrajya dui haare, jharena shaana haamro" or something to this effect from Gopal Prasad Rimal's beautiful song, "Jungi Nishaan" would be more acceptable to me to be incorporated in the national anthem (just the line not the poem) than "Paschim ma Kangada and purba ma Tista pugetheyaun". Yes, pugetheyaun, but just for 12 years and that too is scarred by an ugly record. Hence, not a "classic" achievement of the past that, i) is first-rate, and ii) stands the test of time.
Manashalu-ji, thank you for posing the question and allowing me to clarify this.
|
| Parakhi |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 10:48 AM
Gaunchha Geeta Nepali.. very good rastriya geet. But, I see some problem to adopt it as national anthem because of its length if sung in full. Too long to stand up when it is being sung.....
=====================
Once Late King Birendra went to visit Taplejung. Taplejung has majority of Limbuwan population who are very best at singing and dancing at Dhan Nach/Chandi Nach. If you recall, Dhan Nach has very slow. Eee...........e..ee.............eee....eeeeee..eeeeeeeeeeeeeee.....eeeeeee.... Haa........ha....aaaaaaaaa..........aa................a...................aaa........................~
So the people stood up for rastriya geet. Everybody stood up including the king.... Rastriya geet started in Dhan nach tune....
Shi.......................i......iiiiiiiii..i................iiiiii.......................i.....................Ri...................i...............iii..................i....................i........................e...............e................eeeeeeeeeeeeeee................iiiiiiiiiiiiiii.................. Ma.....................aaaaaaaaaaaaaaa....................aa....................aa..................au...............au....................a.............aaaaaaaaaa.....................nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.
The king tired of standing up and vowed never to come to Taplejung again...
(and we used to enjoy this when Lakpa used to sing it after midnight with every body standing up with their last peg of tharra at their hand.)
|
| QreUS.. |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 11:34 AM
National Anthems of our neighbors....
BANGLADESH
(Amar Shonar Bangla)
My Bengal of gold, I love you
Forever your skies, your air set my heart in tune
as if it were a flute,
In Spring, Oh mother mine, the fragrance from
your mango-groves makes me wild with joy-
Ah, what a thrill!
In Autumn, Oh mother mine,
in the full-blossomes paddy fields,
I have seen spread all over - sweet smiles!
Ah, what a beauty, what shades, what an affection
and what a tenderness!
What a quilt have you spread at the feet of
banyan trees and along the banks of rivers!
Oh mother mine, words from your lips are like
Nectar to my ears!
Ah, what a thrill!
If sadness, Oh mother mine, casts a gloom on your face,
my eyes are filled with tears!
-----------------------
SHRILANKA
Mother Lanka we worship Thee!
Plenteous in prosperity, Thou,
Beauteous in grace and love,
Laden with corn and luscious fruit
And fragrant flowers of radiant hue,
Giver of life and all good things,
Our land of joy and victory,
Receive our grateful praise sublime,
Lanka! we worship Thee.
Thou gavest us Knowledge and Truth,
Thou art our strength and inward faith,
Our light divine and sentient being,
Breath of life and liberation.
Grant us, bondage free, inspiration.
Inspire us for ever.
In wisdom and strength renewed,
Ill-will, hatred, strife all ended,
In love enfolded, a mighty nation
Marching onward, all as one,
Lead us, Mother, to fullest freedom.
-----------------------
INDIA
(Jana-gana-mana-adhinayaka, jaya he
Bharata-bhagya-vidhata
Punjab-Sindhu-Gujarata-Maratha
Dravida-Utkala-Banga
Vindhya-Himachala-Yamuna-Ganga
Uchchala-Jaldhi-taranga
Tava shubha name jage
Tava shubha ashish mange
Gahe tava jaya-gatha
Jana-gana-mangala-dayaka jaya he
Bharata-bhagya-vidhata
Jaya he, jaya he, jaya he
Jaya jaya jaya, jaya he!)
Thou art the rulers of the minds of all people,
dispenser of India's destiny.
Thy name rouses the hearts of Punjab, Sind, Gujarat and Maratha,
Of the Dravida and Orissa and Bengal;
It echoes in the hills of the Vindhyas and Himalayas,
mingles in the music of Yamuna and Ganga and is chanted by
the waves of the Indian Sea.
They pray for thy blessings and sing thy praise.
The saving of all people waits in thy hand,
thou dispenser of India's destiny,
Victory, victory, victory to thee.
-----------------------
PAKISTAN
(Pak sarzameen shad bad Kishwar-e-Haseen shad bad
Tou Nishaan-e-Azm-e-aali shan Arz-e-Pakistan
Markaz-e-yaqeen Shad bad
Pak sarzameen ka nizaam Qouwat-e-Akhouwat-e-Awam
Qaum mulk saltanat Painda tabinda bad
Shad bad Manzil-e-murad
Parcham-e-Sitara-o-Hilal Rahbar-e-Tarakkeey-o-Kamal
Tarjumaan-e-mazee-shaan-e-Hal Jan-e-Istaqbal
Saaya-e-Khuda-e-zuljalal)
Blessed be the sacred land Happy be the bounteous realm
Symbol of high resolve Land of Pakistan
Blessed be thou of faith
The Order of this sacred land is the might of the brotherhood of the people
May the nation, the country, and the state Shine in glory everlasting
Blessed be the goal of our ambition
This flag of Crescent and Star Leads the way to progress and perfection
Interpreter of our past glory of our present Inspiration of our future,
Symbol of Almighty's protection
-----------------------
MALDIVES
We salute you in this national unity.
We salute you, with many good wishes in the national tongue,
Bowing the head in respect to the national symbol.
We salute the flag that has such might;
It falls into the sphere of victory, fortune and success
With its green and red and white together, and therefore we salute it.
To those heroes who sought out honour and pride for the nation
We give salute today in auspicious verses of remembrance.
May the nation of the Maldivian Islanders advance under guard and protection
And the name of the Maldivian Islanders become great.
Thus we pledge as we salute.
We wish for their freedom and progress in this world
And for their freedom from sorrows, and thus we salute.
With full respect and heartfelt blessing towards religion and our leaders,
We salute you in uprightness and truth.
May the State ever have auspicious honour and respect.
With good wishes for your continuing might, we salute you.
-----------------------
BHUTAN
In the Thunder Dragon Kingdom
Adorned with sandalwood,
The protector who guards the
Teachings of the dual system,
He, the precious and glorious ruler,
Causes dominion to spread,
While his unchanging person abides
In costancy.
As the doctrine of the Lord Buddha
Flourishes,
May the sun of peace and happiness
Shine on the people!
|
| anthem |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 12:06 PM
National anthems of Britain, Japan, USA and Switzerland
********************************
Britain
God Save the Queen
God save our gracious Queen,
Long live our noble Queen,
God save the Queen!
Send her victorious,
Happy and glorious,
Long to reign over us,
God save the Queen!
O lord God arise,
Scatter our enemies,
And make them fall!
Confound their knavish tricks,
Confuse their politics,
On you our hopes we fix,
God save the Queen!
Not in this land alone,
But be God's mercies known,
From shore to shore!
Lord make the nations see,
That men should brothers be,
And form one family,
The wide world ov'er
From every latent foe,
From the assasins blow,
God save the Queen!
O'er her thine arm extend,
For Britain's sake defend,
Our mother, prince, and friend,
God save the Queen!
Thy choicest gifts in store,
On her be pleased to pour,
Long may she reign!
May she defend our laws,
And ever give us cause,
To sing with heart and voice,
God save the Queen!
***************************
Japan
Thousands of years of happy reign be thine;
Rule on, my lord, till what are pebbles now
By age united to mighty rocks shall grow
Who's venerable sides the moss doth line.
*****************
USA
Oh, say can you see, by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming?
Whose broad stripes and bright stars, through the perilous fight,
O'er the ramparts we watched, were so gallantly streaming?
And the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there.
O say, does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?
On the shore, dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, now conceals, now discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines on the stream:
'Tis the star-spangled banner! O long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.
And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion
A home and a country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wiped out their foul footstep's pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave:
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.
Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved homes and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heaven-rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, for our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner forever shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!
*****************************
Switzerland
Seh ' I steps to high-raised, wonderful ones you in the jet sea, you, you into morning red therefore,! If the alps Firn reddens itself, prays, free Swiss, prays, your pious soul suspects God in the hehren native country! God, the gentleman, in the hehren native country!
It seems that guidelines given to chakrapani chalise to write national anthem at that time was to write similar national anthem of Great Britain
|
| singapore |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 12:16 PM
May Singapore Progress
Let us, the people of Singapore
Together march towards happiness.
Our noble aspiration is to make
a success of Singapore.
Let us unite
With a great new spirit
Let us proclaim
Onward Singapore!
Onward Singapore
|
| pauna |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 01:12 PM
Parakhi Ji,
Dhaan Nach is not just aaaaaaaa....eeeeeeeeeeee.... and some of your BS. People of Mechi Anchal are not that slow nor are anyone from Taplejung. Respect the culture of people next time in all your posting.
|
| Dilasha |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 02:42 PM
Very interesting topic whoever brought it up. I too feel that our national anthem definitely needs to be changed into something meaningful and inspiring, something that will make us feel proud of who we are everytime we hear it. I have forgotten some of the good national songs they play on the radio but I do remember one which I really love and like Paschim I too would prefer this as our national anthem: "Raato cha chandra surya, jangi nishana hamro, jiundo ragat sari yo baldacha shaan hamro" (wish I remembered the whole song). This would definitely make it on the top list if there was a selection.
In my opinion, mentioning any particular person's name be it Sita or Bhrikuti or Buddha in our national anthem would raise questions as it has with the King, not that I don't admire them but choosing particular names might lead people to ask "well, what about the others who have equally contributed to our country's development or perhaps even more than the above-mentioned people?" Therefore, I would rather prefer an anthem which, besides glorifying the natural beauty of our country (with all the mountains, hills, lakes, rivers that have symbolic meanings attached to them) also honors the heroes who fought for the country that is so beautiful and despite being so small how it has enveloped us all in its loving arms and we all have been lucky to identify ourselves as Nepali. Something that would touch on the essense of national unity and strength would be a perfect theme for a national anthem.
|
| arun valley |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 03:49 PM
I would like to see tarai, pahad, himal, diversity, and flag, among others in our new national anthem.
We can pick some lines from this 8th grade song:
Tarai hera kati ramro hariyo ban hunale
Pahad here jhanai ramro gurans fulnale
Ma ta jhilke yesai ramro nepali hunale
Sagarmatha mero sir ko topi bhaidinale
I agree that the Jangi Nisan and Gaunchha geet nepali are the best options (with some modifications) available. But I would like to add my favorite rastriya geet here, which mentions chautari, mela, rodi, bhailo, and what not!
Singers: Arun Thapa, Saroj Gopal, Baba Rana
Composer: Navaraj Karki
Lyricist: Saroj Gopal
http://arunvalley.com/karod.ram
Enjoy!
|
| ..but |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 03:54 PM
...but
'rato ra chandra surya, jangi nishan hamro
Jinudo ragat sari baldo yo shan hamro
........'
mainly describes about our national flag and it's dignified history, hoina ra ?
|
| Parakhi |
Posted
on 03-Jul-02 05:17 PM
Paunaji, I felt my Dhan Nach stuff in regular posting should have been posted in humor section. My apology to hurt your feelings.
I have been to few Dhan Nach and Chandi Nach and have enjoyed it from depth along with my Limbu and Rai friends. I never meant to make fun of certain cultural groups.
|
| Fursati |
Posted
on 04-Jul-02 11:26 AM
National anthem ko criticism interesting lagyo, but
we can not change everything because it is old. England and Japan are very old and democratic countries, and their anthem's sing the praise of their king and queen much more than ours. Yet no British or Japanese trashes his anthem...it is just a historical vestige...or cultural icon.
By the way, is there any country that has no anthem?
|
