| Username |
Post |
| ashu |
Posted
on 15-Apr-01 10:46 AM
Hi San and others,
Great job on the new face of this site, though I must
confess that -- after coming back to this site after a
few days -- I was momentarily taken aback to see the
BLACK screen pop up [thought I had entered some porn
site :-)]
That said, I do have a minor quibble on your use of
the word Nepalese.
Nepali or Nepalese -- though BOTH are correct, which is
preferable for PUBLIC use?
I vote for "Nepali', and here are my reasons.
Nepalese is a term the British in India gave us.
It's a 'phoren' word.
We call ourselves Nepalis and NOT Nepalese.
Should we keep on using the Anglicized version of the word 'Nepali'even when we are addressing one another here?
Nepali, however, is our own term.
Even a big authority like the New York Times uses "Nepali"
and NOT Nepalese, when describing the people or the major language of Nepal. Ditto for World Bank publications,
Himal South Asia magazine, the Nepali Times newspaper
and so on.
Logically, if a resident of
Palpa is Palpali and NOT Palpalese, a resident of
Dang is Dangali and NOT Dangalese, a resident of
Syangja is Syangjali and NOT Syangjalese, a resident of
Gorkha is Gorkhali and NOT Gorkhalese,
should not a resident of (or matters pertaining to) Nepal
be called Nepali?
What do others think?
Nepali or Nepalese?
It may be a minor matter; still, let's share thoughts.
Happy New Year everyone; wishing all you all the success
in this New Year.
oohi
ashu
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| San |
Posted
on 15-Apr-01 12:43 PM
Hello Ashu welcome back. Your absense was beginning to get noticed around here.
Regarding the usage or the word Nepali or Nepalese. Here are my thoughts. I would like to add here that I am no authority with any linguistic credentials and these are just my current opinion.
When speaking in the language of Nepal ie Nepali or Nepalese, however you choose to refer to it, we call the people of Japan - Japani, China - Chini, Bhutan - Bhutani, etc. So it's understandable that people refer to Palpali, Gorkhali, etc.
However when speaking in English, the people of the countries above are referred as Japanese, Chinese, Bhutanese, etc.
I think it's not right to impose the English speaking world to implement the Nepali version of the words. I don't know what the Japanese people call themselves, or the Chinese, or the Russians, but I'm sure English language would get pretty complicated if every other country wanted their people to be refered to in their own language! I know 'Nepali' is not too complicated to say or write but I'm sure there are lots of other language in the world with consonants that we don't know exist.
As long as the meaning is clear, I think it's okay to go with it. I use 'Nepalese' to refer to the people of Nepal because of my reasoning above. I totally understand people when they use 'Nepali' to refer to the same thing. Is there a STANDARD that defines what's the right word to use?
When a foreign diplomat calls us Nepalese as opposed to Nepali, this should not be a topic of debates. Instead let's find out and utilize what he/she has to offer us!
Ma Nepali and I'm Nepalese!
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| Hari |
Posted
on 15-Apr-01 10:01 PM
NEPALI, here's why:
Sure, English has become THE global language, but that shouldn't prevent us from calling ourselves who we are. 'Nepalese' certainly is anglification, and the "westerners" have been using these anglifications for THEIR benefit, not the "global" benefit, if that's the argument someone may want to use for using 'Nepalese'. But despite their intentions, transliterations (as opposed to 'inventions', in the form of, I'll call you...umm...Daisybearers, because I sort of like that name, and your real name "Algolongoni'tunbhumpi" is too long and difficult) have also worked as alternatives. And, transliterations are being introduced and accepted, like Myanmar, Mumbai, Kolkota, Chennai, etc. etc. In a way, I guess we should be happy that they at least got our country's name right :-)
NEPALI, not just because:
NY Times, The World Bank, IMF, US of A, The Economist, Alan Greenspan, Bill Clinton, say it so. (But, Kudos to them if they're calling us Nepalis now because they've realized that we don't call ourselves Nepalese).
Conclusion:
In the final analysis, the question is: are we content in being called what the "westerners" called us (with perhaps the best of intentions) for their lingual benefit? Or do we want to correct them and call ourselves who we are? After all, I'm sure all of us have, at one point, been annoyed by that person who cannot pronounce our names properly, or vice-versa.
Dui Paise Musings from a NEPALI,
Hari
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| Hari |
Posted
on 15-Apr-01 10:09 PM
Sorry for the second post, missed San's post:
If all of us, Americans, Nepalis, and everyone else alike, were considerate and called each other by the correct designations, there would be a single name for each nationality, and a correct one at that. Americans and Nepalis alike would call all Englishpeople 'English', all Germans 'Deutsch', and all "Japanese" "Chinese" and "Koreans" whatever they REALLY call themselves.
Hari
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| ashu |
Posted
on 15-Apr-01 11:51 PM
Hi San,
There is really NO fixed standard re: whether one should
use Nepali or Nepalese.
I think it boils down to preferences.
My point is: Should we start using Nepali
INSTEAD of Nepalese? So, the Greater Boston
Nepali Community instead of Greater Boston
Nepalese Community; and ditto for Nepali
New Year instead of Nepalese New Year,
and so on.
Nepali sounds, well, more Nepali
than the Anglicized Nepalese.
oohi
ashu
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| namita |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 10:04 AM
Nepali or Nepalese?
My vote also goes to Nepali. Without going to the politics of language I prefer to call myself Nepali. I correct those ignorant whites that dare to call me Nepalese. It is just like in some part of Nepal (especially in villages) they call a white face ‘Amrikan’ and if that white face happens to be a female species then ‘Amrekanni!’ They give these nouns without any malicious thought or callousness. This is what they think this white face should be referred to. So I think above everything, this is just a little ignorance from know-it-all, my-view-is-correct colonialism. Without raising a red flag of raging feminism, why is it that they refer their God as ‘He'? Don’t you think it is pure sexism? Who has seen this so-called guy anyway? Sorry Ashu, without provocation sometime I veer off.
namita
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| namita |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 11:59 AM
ps
Hare` Hari, your musing(s)-
They are quite amusing
Who says they are “dui paise?”
It is worth a million buck, I say!
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| null |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 01:55 PM
What's in a name?
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| null |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 02:09 PM
What I want is their respect (or even acknowledgement) for our country (how many of us have that I don't know) than what they call us by, Nepali or Nepalese? Some of us may think one to be more appropriate than the other. But I beg to differ. As long as they call us by term that's correct according to their grammar, does it really matter? And I don't at all find "Nepalese" offensive! Shouldn't this discussion be in Nepali if that was the case. Each country is unique and each has it own culture and language and we cannot impose ourselves upon them. Also we mis-pronounce "their" name as much as we mis-pronounce theirs, so we're even there...
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| Gurung |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 04:20 PM
Namitaji, yes you certainly veer off. It is interesting how you bring up feminism in this discussion that does not have anything to do with it. I fail to understand how you even relate the 'Amrikan' and 'Amrekanni' issue with the 'Nepali' and 'Nepalese' issue!
I can't help but muse over why you only mention 'ignorant whites' isn't that racism? I might be wrong here and there must not have been any 'black', 'brown' or 'yellow' ignorants who have dared to call you 'Nepalese'. Is that so?
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| null |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 05:13 PM
read "they mis-pronounce ours..." at the end of my previous posting.
And if Amrikan and Amrikani is said without any malice or callousness, can't it be Nepalese without any of those feelings too? And where does God fit into all this? Let HIM be where HE is...
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| San |
Posted
on 17-Apr-01 10:51 PM
I believe that saying 'Nepali' or 'Nepalese' is totally upto the person. For some people the word 'Nepali' might be loaded with feelings of nationalism which they don't want to give up although living in a foreign country and speaking in foreign tongue for decades. Some can still say they're 'Nepalese' and love Nepal more than anything. Some people might want them to be called 'Nepali'. Some people might not mind being called either.
There are no set of rules that define what needs to be said. As long as the meaning is understood that's what matters. Even dictionaries and encyclopedias accept both words.
On the same note, I have seen many people making a big deal about other people calling them their names EXACTLY the same as done in their native language. Although I totally understand that it's just a matter of choice that they have chosen to speak up for, personally I don't think it's a big deal. I'd rather accept and acknowledge the fact that they are talking about me or talking to me than spend the next 20 minutes trying to teach them how to pronounce a word they never heard in thier life.
Just because others can't pronounce your name correctly does not mean they are stupid or ignorant. Yes they are ignorant when it come to your language just as you are ignorant about Latin. I understand that for lot of people their NAME represent their individualism and they are welcome to continue to spend couple of minutes every other day boosting their sense of individuality.
It all boils down to choice. Different people do things differently based on what they think is the right thing to do, which in turn is based on their individual experiences.
If the same (is it patriotic?) logic is followed in requiring the word 'Nepali' to be used instead of 'Nepalese', we should be requiring these 'ignorant' English speaking people to start speaking in fluent 'Nepali' too!
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