| Username |
Post |
| SimpleGal |
Posted
on 28-Oct-02 01:49 PM
Dear all,
When I was giving an orientation talk at one of the institutions of interest to recruit participants (adolescents) for my research this summer in Nepal, something intriguing came up. After some time into the talk, I could see their glazed eyes. Ok, I was surely droning on in my typical lecture giving mode! No, I did not want to be defensive and blame things on the weather, although being human, that was quite a seductive temptation!
A thought flashed through my mind. Fortunately, the ensuing remark was not a disjointed one. I interjected the talk quickly with "And of course, we'll have food and soft-drinks available." An Instant shift in the aura of the room. For a psychologist, it was a phenomenological and observable difference. :) Noting this change, but quite inadvertently I must confess, I blurted out, "You see, food has its own psychology!" A wave of pleasant laughter in the room. Many people signed up for participation. Esp. the boys in the group. The toughest part was getting the boys to sign up initially since I was (and am!) a female researcher. But they were a great and sweet group, nevertheless!
The prospect of having food at the panel discussion worked well to encourage partiicipation, given our culture where soft spoken people, esp. women, are prized denizens of a "sundar, shant, bishal" country. "Aimai bhaera bharta bolne haina hai!!"
Anticipated question from fellow sajhaites: So, SimpleGal, what's your point?
My response: Does food have its own psychology? And does it differ for men and women?
Again, a query might be posed: Well, SimpleGal, why don't you tell us?
My response: I wouldn't have created this thread if I knew the answer! :)
The aforementioned remark about the valued trait of silence in our culture, I hope, will be an useful instrument to address the topic embedded in the question I pose above.
In any case and therefore :), I would love to hear what you all have to say about The Psychology of Food. Unabashed anecdotal info. is invaluable, but not exclusively mandatory!
In Peace.
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| Junkie |
Posted
on 28-Oct-02 01:59 PM
Hmmm ....... if there's one thing where size does matter ...... it's food .... I weep at the size of Sushi, I rejoice like a baby with bagful of candies, every time i get to super size my meals! ....... Hence bigger the size, bigger the happiness .......
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| boston_dude |
Posted
on 28-Oct-02 02:16 PM
Nothing simple about the question u pose "SimpleGal" :)
I heard somewhere, some place that the 3 words which get the most attention from a crowd are: FREE, FOOD, and SEX. I guess most people love to eat, especially if it is free and everyone loves... dare I go there? But, to be more serious, I think people respond to food because unlike most other things we involve ourselves in our daily routine, food is associated with fun. We normally sit with friends or family and enjoy food. We normally allow ourselves to relax, allow ourselves to enjoy the moment when we are having food. So, could it be because of this association with having a good time that we react in this positive manner when the word "food" is thrown at us in the middle of a boring talk? :)
I hope I am not totally off track here.
B_D.
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| bhedo |
Posted
on 28-Oct-02 02:43 PM
No Junkie, size does not matter, even in the case of food. Ever heard of the Japanese guy who can gobble up 50+ hotdogs in less that 10 minutes or so? That dude is so puny, and his mouth isn't that large. God know how his esophagus can take it all in. The dude doesn't even chomp em down.
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| Logical Sense |
Posted
on 28-Oct-02 03:32 PM
"Free Food Tastes Better!" was explanation of one of my coleagues in my company when we were talking about free lunch at our company.
Interestingly I was thinking we dived for free food only in Nepal, but, alas, here in US even the CEO of companies are fist in line to get the free food (and they will talk about 'FREE' food to all the prospective employees sounding it 'BIG'). Only difference these people might stay in line to get free food and in Nepal they will try to short which might look litte undisciplined - but so what it is same thing.
Indian Tandoori food and Chinese food are best eaten. I have seen people taking at least two helpings (a big pile of food in each plate). When there is Indian food in our office, the late comers never get the food.
In my class I offer donuts at the end of lecture and I get 100% attendance that day (I announe this on my first day).
So, bottom line, it is neither gender based, nor it is culture based, it is just matter of 'FREE' my dear. Just watch all these commercials where they have 'FREE' in big highlighted fonts (and may be 'buy one get one free' in fine prints.....).
- iti
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| dirk |
Posted
on 28-Oct-02 03:33 PM
I don't too much about the psychological ramifications of food per se but here is an observation I've made while I was in Nepal a couple a years back. If you plan to have a press conference, be sure to put it in the invites that.." drinks and refreshments will be served". This will guarantee the attendance of press corps from all corners. Nothing gives you coverage like some tidbits and drinks especially if you can afford to offer some alcoholic beverage.
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| SimpleGal |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 07:54 AM
Boston_Dudeji and Logical Senseji,
Thanks for your insightful input. LSji, donuts bhaeko din matra 100% attendance? :)
BDji, don't worry, you're right on track. Thanks.
Indeed, the word "Free" may have something to do with people's responses. Haven't heard from the women at Sajha. :) Can I persuade you ladies to kindly put in your dui shabda?
Bhedoji, Dirkji, and Junkieji,
Thank you, too, for your input.
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| vivid |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 10:36 AM
The 'food psychology', might have worked out due to:
- A free offer is highly irresistible.
- The state of hunger of an individual during that period(declaration of food availability).
- A diversion induced to break the monotone.
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| Suna |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 10:38 AM
the lure of food but I guess we go back to WHY!!
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| najar |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 12:13 PM
Simplegal, this could be a slight digress from what you are looking for, but this thread reminded me of a movie by Ang Lee--Eat Drink Man Woman. Have you seen it? In the movie food is shown to be intertwined with so many other factors--frustration, desire, communication gap, responsibilities, relationship, misunderstandings and ofcourse food being an essential element of life. Most of the movie setting also takes place in the kitchen, with food, cooking and eating. An interesting comedy movie, indeed...
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 12:21 PM
FOOD: for the Body
FOOD: for the Mind and the Psyche
FOOD:for the Intellect
FOOD: for the Spirit
FOOD: for the Soul
Food...
...Falls into Maslow's hierarchy of basic human needs.... Although, he refers to the physical form of food for the nourishment of the body to ensure its biological functions, I will take the forms of food further and attempt to elaborate upon it.
Food for the body: ...Man is born and dies; inbetween he is preoccupied with filling his belly and below. Perhaps, we can explain jobs, job hunts, migration, ....and all our modern day headaches to the need to "forage" for food...to keep our appetites sated. Yes... Sexual appetite too ( for all those wondering ....where the hell does, sex fall?) But as we reach out for fodder to "nourish" our bodies, do we reflect upon the its quality?
Food for the mind...
... a mind that balances its polarities of the dark and light; of optimism and pessimism; of love and hate; of ying and yang; needs "food" or the ability to expand beyond the "norms and to look above the ceilings and below the undergrowth....What is that mind that is stuck to a stationary point in time while the whole world metamorphs through a continuous change. What use is that mind that has recorded an obsolete map.
A mind that rejects flexibility manifests itself into a maimed psyche.
Food for the Intellect...
is the desire to learn, absorb and implement. The moment the intellect stops absorbing new information; it starts dying a slow painful death....as it feeds off of stale information. It is a quest for knowledge; a natural human tendency!
Food for the Spirit...The spirit of man lies in its natural state. Nature provides the sheltering foliage for peace. Getting immersed in hobbies that help grow and extend oneself beyond a job/need. The creative Arts and Literature (one example...among many): Music and fine art help to express and appreciate the immeasurable; the abstract and the illusary.
Food for the Soul...
What can be more profound than the knowledge that we (all creatures) are guided by a higher power; an unseen force and energy that help us abide by the laws of nature (universal law). The need to acknowledge the higher power is expressed in sacred rituals, religious philosophy and spiritual ethics ... definitely, a necessary fodder for the soul.
My versions of FOOD!
:)
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| dirk |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 12:25 PM
Najar, That (EDMW) was indeed a treat!!! Have you seen The Cook, The Thief, His Wife & Her Lover (1989)?
Peter Greenaway's next film after Drowning by Numbers is this more accessible offering about sex, lust, food, gluttony, murder and revenge. It's a controversial film and has a NC-17 rating in the US. The film opens with a vulgar scatological scene, when a man is smeared with excrement by 'The Thief', Albert Spica. Most of the film is set in an elegant gourmet restaurant called Le Hollandais. Spica dines at this restaurant frequently, along with his gorgeous wife Georgina (played by solemnly sexy Helen Mirren) and his group of uncouth associates.
Spica is a vulgarian, who growls his orders towards those around him. Georgina then becomes fixated with a customer in the restaurant (Alan Howard) and the two of them have a dangerous sexual affair there. Eventually, Spica discovers their liaison, and the film draws to its memorable and shocking conclusion, which is the ultimate retribution. Sumptuous to look like at and superbly performed.
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 01:27 PM
Dirk ji
Sounds like an interesting film!
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| najar |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 03:51 PM
No Dirk, I have not seen that movie but will look out for it, sounds interesting!
On another note now that i am at it, I sometimes wonder why is food linked so much with everything? Even for myself, when I am bored eat; when i am nervous I eat, when i stay up late I eat esp junks at these times. When there is something to celebrate, i go out to eat. Food is always in mind, so much like this father cooking all the time in that EDMW movie. So its all food, food and food. Do I make any sense?
Perhaps time to go home, paanch bajna laagyo....
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| SimpleGal |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 05:26 PM
Najarji,
Yes, I've seen Ang Lee's "Eat Drink Man Woman". Another one is a Spanish delight called "Like Water For Chocolate" where the sensuality of food is entwined with the same of the woman. Seriously, I loved the way she mixes the rose petals to make the quail dish! But of course, it creates quite a havoc! :)
You are not alone. Recently, I have started keeping a packet of Twix, Werthers and a bag o' Chips RIGHT NEXT to my bed!! Just within reach for those late night cravings. Get 3-4 hrs of sleep each night--Grad life :). That darn alarm clock is a Sauta. So, what wakes me up? The prospect of having food! Lol....
Dirkji,
Will watch the movie you suggested this Christmas. :)
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| SimpleGal |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 05:49 PM
Sitara,
Great analysis. Maslow's hierarchy....hmmm....good one! :)
Loved your Zennist approach to Food For Spirit. Can't forget my Japanese Zen Buddhism prof.during Undergrad days: Zen is about living.
Beautiful.
Btw, here is one of the koans I wrote for my Zen class:
If only things were simpler, then,
I could assay to understand,
What length of sky the sparrows fly,
What breadth of shore has sand?
In peace.
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| protean |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 07:08 PM
Huh, this has invoked my curiosity about "food"
Interesting posting Simple gal.
Creative remarks there Sitara.
Few thoughts of mine.
According to the Pavlovian experiment, the dog would start salivating (after some training) immediately after hearing the bell --thinking there was food.
What could be the pavlovian equivalnet for the humans? The food for the body equivalent would be the rush for "free Pizzas" at the companies. Anything for free (especially food) would proabably connotate to something unthinkabke as we've reminded that, "there is no thing as free lunch".
Do we as human beings (say if our appetites is not the least of our concerns) , try to satisfy the hunger for knoweldge more (the intellect) ,or do we strive hard to reach for the spiritual "nutrients"? What kind of food does discussions at Sajha provide?
Does the serach for the" type of food" depend on age or disposition?
What is the hunger that drives us to creativity--it's the food for the spirit according to Sitara. What is the pavlovian equivalent for this?
What about the Soul? Can we reach that stage of knowing the soul? What guides this?
Mahatma Gandhi, Einstein, Buddha, Feynman, Tagore, to name a few craved for differnt kinds of food. Did Gandhi want all four types ? What about Buddha?
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| ashu |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 07:50 PM
Simple Gal,
While on the topic of food, let me -- as a former, along with three other friends, restaurant critic of The Kathmandu Post . . . ahem!! ahem!! -- recommend two
excellently readable books:
"Kitchen Confidential" by Anthony Bourdain for its high-energy, entertaining writing about the restaurant industry. I understand that Bourdain has come out with a new book now, but haven't had a chance to get that yet.
and
"The Man Who Ate Everything" by Jeffrey Steingarten for a somewhat witty, informative and semi-academic take on food.
Then there's the present Gourmet magazine's editor Ruth Reichl's two delightful memoirs: "Comfort me with apples" , and "Tender at the bone". They even come
with recipes.
It's time you combined your obvious love of literature (i.e. good writing) with food.
Bon appetit!
oohi
ashu
ktm,nepal
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| Harvard_Dropout |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 08:10 PM
Simple Gal and Others:
I think as long as we are in the topic of food we should revisit the "Interrelationship between HIV/AIDS/STIs and Seasonal Migration as a Result of Food Insecurity in the Mid and Far Western Regions of Nepal." Several studies from the Mid and Far Western Regions of Nepal have concluded that seasonal and sporadic migration to India are directly attributed to food insecurity. That is, in some districts, such as Kalikot and Mugu, local food production meets only approximately six months of food supply at reduced calorie intake of around 1,800. Thus, there is a compulsion to migrate to India. Rest we know, migration, extra-marital sexual affairs, returning to family members as the women back home do not possess the necessary condom negotiation skills, etc.
I would like to hear your comments from you some seven seas away on this issue.
A footnote to this whole issue is the fact that the Maoist Insurgency has expedited the volume and magnitude of seasonal and permanent migration to adjoining Terai Districts and the Indian States south of the Border. That sure will not help to ease the progression of HIV/AIDS/STIs in the Nepali landscape.
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 29-Oct-02 08:57 PM
Simple gal ,
Although, I am a Zennist, I was not referring to Zen or any other religion and/ or philosophy in particular.
Nice Koan though.
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 30-Oct-02 11:14 AM
Protean ji,
Thank you for your comments...
Methinks, the Pavlovian equivalent to the dog's salivating impulse may be measured by the saying "Bhok Mitho ki Bhat Mitho" hoina hajur? Think about it, when hungry, just the mere thought of food can trigger off a chain reaction of growling stomachs, salivating mouths, drooling tongues............wagging tails (? :)
To address the quest for knowledge:
Don't you think it is the state of mind/disposition and company one keeps that demands the quest for information...? I remember reading "Atma Bodh" and "Tatwa Bodh" just because my mom was reading them. I was 11 yrs old at the time. But I also recall picking up "The Holocaust" and "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" at the same time. This, merely to delve into the psyche of the "Nazi mind" and its attrocities...and also to balance the "Archies" and "Amar Chitra Katha" Days.
The search for the "soul" or "soul food" comes not from age but from exeriences in life, no? The ability to transcend difficulties stems from a basic trust in life itself. As M. Scott Peck eloquently expresses,(to lightly paraphrase it) "Life is difficult and the sooner you understand it the easier it becomes"! Once such an understanding has taken root, the complex superlatives don't matter much. To elaborate further, the need/greed to grasp the best, the most, the highest, the smartest..... becomes insignificant hoina ra? One is no longer in the rat race and yet one can Keep Up the Pace with peace, sanity and serenity.
How old do you need to be to reach this state???????? My answer; when you are old enough to think and reflect upon what you think.
And yes, all this discussed under the title of "Food for the soul/spirit/intellect" ....:)
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| SITARA |
Posted
on 30-Oct-02 01:13 PM
Dhumbasse ji
Can't find your posting after mine...although I can see a jhalak of your name!
:(
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| DHUMBASSE (DUMBASS) |
Posted
on 30-Oct-02 01:23 PM
Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaha!! there was nothing important so i had it removed, hehehehe
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| Junkie |
Posted
on 30-Oct-02 09:40 PM
Exactly Bhedo jee ...... See what I mean Bhedo jee ......You contradict ......
Size Does matter ...... if not a beefed up size, a large quantity of Hot dogs nai sahee ......
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| Junkie |
Posted
on 30-Oct-02 09:55 PM
I challenge Maslow ...... A self riteous man will never settle for a burger from a corrupt official even when he's starving ...... "bhok hadtal" ...... So much for the dichotomy between self-esteem (need 4) and physiological (need 1).
Seen many examples of Nepalese mothers feed their young even when they starve (aba movie ko example nai hosh nah). So much for his categorization of love (need 3) and physiological need (need 1) .....
Tara I agree with Sitara jee ......
Food for a hippie ...... Sharing a spliff with baba-jees at Pashupati, accompanied by a hot milk (alloyed with kuni kay kay stuff in it) :)
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| SimpleGal |
Posted
on 31-Oct-02 06:27 AM
Ashuji,
Thanks for recommending the books to combine literature with food. I hadn't really thought of it! Will read them when I get a chance.
Proteanji,
Just read your posting. VERY intriguing queries indeed. Will address them in my next posting. In a rush at the moment.
In peace.
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| KaLaNkIsThAn |
Posted
on 31-Oct-02 06:28 AM
Sorry, I didn't read 'em all, so if I go off track, Maaf paau.
I don't know psychology, philosophy, physics, bhugol and biology of food, but there are something that I read somewhere, that stuck to my brain because it made sense to me. Jaati naahi, jaaati nahi, dimag se jaati nahi.
It said, men should eat like a man. Throw some extra cheese on your burger, Take your time and eat like hantakaali. Man should never diet or eat less. But after you eat, you should workout like a man. Burn every calories, and fat and whatnot from your system.
Women shouldnt' eat like a men re. I don't know why.. their system is different than men re...
hyaaa. why am i writing this??
dimag khuskyaa jasto cha mero ni
sorry hai
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| dirk |
Posted
on 31-Oct-02 01:05 PM
Psychology of Food....http://www.ffl.org/html/psychology_of_food.html
The Bhagavad gita states that all foods can be classified according to the three modes of material nature - goodness, passion, and ignorance. These modes (or characteristics of the material energy) directly influence our mind, body, and intelligence. The subtle influence of these modes are sometimes compared to the strings of a pupeteer, and they bind and manipulate our senses, causing us to act in ways we sometimes later regret. The Bhagavad gita also states, however, that the soul is not completely helpless -- we do have a choice -- for we are eternally individual beings with a minute degree of independence. The quality of those choices, therefore, directly effects the manner in which the "strings" of the material energy manipulate our destiny. Here Lord Krishna describes the results of eating under the influence of the mode of goodness:
Foods dear to those in the mode of goodness increase the duration of life, purify one's existence and give strength, health, happiness and satisfaction. Such foods are juicy, fatty, wholesome, and pleasing to the heart. (Bhagavad gita 17.8)
The Bhagavad gita further states that vegetables, fruits, nuts, grains, sugar, and milk products are foods in the mode of goodness and may be offered in sacrifice, or in other words: they can be transformed and purified of all karma.
yagya-sishtasinah santo
muchyante sarva-kilbishai
bhunjate te tv agham papa
ye pacanty atma-karanat
The devotees of the Lord are released from all kinds of sins because they eat food which is offered first for sacrifice. Others, who prepare food for personal sense enjoyment, verily eat only sin.
(Bhagavad-gita 3.13)
Foods that cannot be used in sacrifice, or as offerings to the Lord, are described thus:
Foods that are too bitter, too sour, salty, hot, pungent, dry and burning are dear to those in the mode of passion. Such foods cause distress, misery and disease.
(Bhagavad-gita 17.9)
Food prepared more than three hours before being eaten, food that is tasteless, decomposed and putrid, and food consisting of remnants and untouchable things is dear to those in the mode of darkness.
( Bhagavad-gita 17.10)
Srila Prabhupada comments:
Foods in the mode of passion, which are bitter, too salty, or too hot or overly mixed with red pepper, cause misery by reducing the mucus in the stomach, leading to disease. Foods in the mode of ignorance or darkness are essentially those that are not fresh. Any food cooked more than three hours before it is eaten (except prasadam, food offered to the Lord) is considered to be in the mode of darkness. Because they are decomposing, such foods give a bad odor, which often attracts people in this mode but repulses those in the mode of goodness... The best food is the remnants of what is offered to the Supreme Personality of Godhead... Therefore to make food antiseptic, eatable and palatable for all persons, one should offer food to the Supreme Personality of Godhead.
As a general rule, foods in the modes of passion and ignorance are not offerable to God (Krishna), because such eatables "cause pain, distress and disease" and are "putrid, decomposed and unclean." As may be guessed, meat, fish, and eggs are foods in the lower modes. But there are also a few vegetarian items that are classified in the lower modes - garlic and onions*, for example. They cannot be offered in sacrifice, since these foods are sexually agitating and impure, and they directly interfere with the ultimate purpose of eating sanctified foods: to increase the duration of life, purify the mind, aid bodily strength and reestablish our union (yoga) with the supreme.
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| protean |
Posted
on 31-Oct-02 09:18 PM
Sitaraji,insightful views that you shared.
Food for Body
The "bokh mitho ki Bojhan mitho" does apply to the humans in terms of the
Pavlovian equivalent of getting excited at the possibility of getting satiated. That could be a Pavlovian.
But, how about a dash for a Tiramisu, or Belgian Chocolates, Black Forest, or "Momo for those non-veg types" when sighted even when not that hungry?
Couldn't this also be falling in that realm? I think so. I once had some colleagues run for free Pizza and beer in the midst of trying finshing a task. Free for humans could also be equivalent to "the sound of the bell" in Pavlovian context. I suppsoe that is the reason why the Marwaris give tea (and in some cases samosas) to entice customers , and some other marketing gimmicks that are to be seen could have been employed.
Knowledge
As far as the quest for knowledge goes, I suppose this is the food that makes people curious and makes their minds grow. Otherwise, our lives would be pretty boring ,wouldn't it? The balance of these different " nutrients" in your knowledge realm must have made a mark on your mental health ,then. Articulateness, alacrity, and resorucefulness, probably are also the rewards of following such "dietary habits".
These food types would certainly add in greater dimension to the human mind (did I talke about this somewhere else--probably will delve into this in another thread of why and why not???) -:).
Food for Spirit and the Soul. Can't they be combined? Or would the spirit has to enriched first to get to the soul?
Spirit
Yes, Tagore used to desribe in Gitanjali how his spirit was getting away from the earthly and moving towards the "almightly" . I think he meant he was trying to meet up with the ultimate soul. Satisfying the spirit with music, and arts (to name a few) is probably a very transcendtal experience--that's why we feel it and not think about it.
As Tagore once said, "When old words die out on the tongue, new melodies break forth from the heart,", so this longing and hunger mustprevail for those who long to feed their spirit.
Soul
When people say they want to meet or have met their soul mates, do they really mean it or using it as a pilthe statement? Probably, someone else could help reach one's inner soul--but this is in constrast to what meditation says.
As far as understanding and feeding one' soul, I think you're right. This doesn't depend on age, but rather on being able to reflect and be able to feel. So, not thinking and using the rational mind helps in this end, right?
More on this..
What you say??
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