| Sajha.com Archives | |
| Username | Post |
| resham | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 11:30 AM
In our society, still lots of ppl marry within their own caste. why do ppl choose their partner frm their same caste. Is there anything wrong w/ intercaste marriage. |
| vivid | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 11:44 AM
Nothing is wrong with intercaste marriage but one needs guts and willpower to plunge into it. A little bit of flexibility and a bit of compromise will be handy at times. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 11:50 AM
Intercaste marriages are probably the only soultion to save Nepal. Intercaste marriages have to be encouraged to create a singular nepali identity, to minimize the differencs (if not tyotally eliminate them) and to promote nepali nationalism. Go for it Resham. mero subhakamana and congratulations beforehand. |
| vivid | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 11:51 AM
Ryang ko thyang! If ji, haat milaun na hunna?? :) |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 11:56 AM
bhaihalcha ni, being an aquariuan (self promotion), I am always up for making new friends. |
| vivid | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 12:05 PM
Me a piscean, born with a desire to see the world through rose coloured spectacles, re kya ajha. :)) Thanks for the acceptance! |
| SITARA | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 12:31 PM
Vivid ji... You a Piscean?...me a Mermaid! :) ... It takes a lot of commitment, tolerance and independent thought to get into an intercaste marriage! I agree with IF ji about "saving" Nepal and intercaste marriages! |
| sweetie | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 12:58 PM
Sometimes.........It really takes a lot in these kind of marriages............I know our parents are stil not into it. But you know what we can do to change this??.............we will let our kids marry whoever they want to..............a simple solution!!!!! and that will change the narrowminded views and thoughts of our nepali society............ Sajha yatri haru, If we remember this and we let or kids marry Intercaste if they want to................then by the next generation this issue and thoughts against Intercaste Marriages will fade away......but it will really take a lot to change our parents thoughts on this! Great deal of persuation............, Much more sacrifice than imagined will be required sometimes....chances are that one might have to sometimes cut off the complete relationship with their dear ones aswell for Intercaste marriages if it's not approved by family. I have seen it in the past with one of my far relative........too much hassel to go through.......but hey! if you love someone so dearly and it's both sides, I believe it is worth to go for it ! TRUE LOVE is hard to find......if u have it , u shouldnot let it go in anycase. Go for it Resham............! |
| vivid | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 01:20 PM
Sitara ji, I'm still undergoing the phase change of evolution, haven't been able to break the shell to become a mermaid yet, :)) Sweety ji, Why wait for another generation to break the rule? If the wall is allowed to remain there then it will always be there to bar the way. My wishes for those who go for it. |
| Logical Sense | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 01:27 PM
Great thread. I am all for it. Theoritically and Practically! But, are you guys and gals really ready? Get ready for rocky start, if you are thinking of intercaste marriage!!! Talk asides, are you ready for it? Or, have you married in a different caste? Some practical examples: 1) Cypriotes bring Jwain Home. So, if you are a guy are you ready for going to be 'Ghar Jwain'? 2) Muslims marriage is based on simply saying 'Kabul Hai', Bahuns marriage ceremony lasts for at least four days rituals. Are you ready for it? 3) Bahuns 'Goda Dhoga' Jwaines, Newars Jwain 'Goda Dhoga' to Sasura's, what you would do if you marry a Newar or Bahun? Ha Ha Ha, don't jump into conclusion with all the theoritical/emotional rheotoric, but, are you READY my friends? - iti |
| vivid | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 01:38 PM
Khai ho logical sense ji, Ma ke bhanam?? Mera lyaite afanti haru sabai kohi bahuni, chetrini, newarni, raini, gurungni, magarni (list ta kya lamo hune bhayo ke) adi ityandi tara pani khai sabai ko ghar bar ramrai chaleko cha, santan sabai ka tatha batha niskya chan, afanta haru biralai ghar juwain gayeka chan. Sabai ko ramro dekhda ta ramrai hola bhanchu kyare ma ta, ani scientifically pani proven ni intercaste offsprings bright hunchan past generations ko tulana ma bhanera hoina ra?? :))) |
| sweetie | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 01:40 PM
Don't you think making a old woman OR a man (sasu-sasura) " Goda Dogna " is bad..........I think every elderly pple deserve respect so having them bow their forehead on a young mans foot is really mean.............!In my openion........bichara parents...........! I believe Bhawuuun rituals treat female party really low............! Isn't that so? Hami kta pattiko vaneyra nak fulauchan ni! Well...........may be not in everyways..........but most of the time it's that way! |
| Robert Frost | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 04:38 PM
One pleasant morning, I came out of my bed, streched myself, with arms wide open under the sunshine of the utmost pleasure. From the balcony of my house in Nawalparasi, I turned my head around and the magnificent scenery I saw, was beyond my comprehension. My goodness! What a beauty, was the only thing I could speak. The morning ray of sunshine touching Narayani with its gentle touch, an agony of pride and pleasure, that gave it a yellowish color, surrounded my Bhutaha Jungle. I don't know why people called it Bhutaha Jungle. I remember when I was a little child, I asked the Mukhiya, Bhut aucha ho tyaha? That time he scared me by saying Yes, but it was glorious. It was time for the morning hoards to be taken to the Jungle to graze and I could see some of the farmers had already started to prepare their cattles. They go deep inside the Jungle to graze their cattle. I don't know why those people are so not scared of Rhinos and other wild animals that surrounds the jungle. I guess probably because they have been doing that all their life. Suddenly Majhila dai came running towards me and asked me where my grandmother was. I told him she is in Puja I guess. "Can you call her fast, its very urgent". I could see some really bad thing in his eyes. So without further a due, I went straight to the Puja ghar where my Grandmother was deep inside her prayers, felt very bad to disturb her but I told her what had hapenned. She came storming into the balcony where Majhila dai was waiting and asked him what was wrong. Without saying a thing, Majhila dai told my Granny to come with him to Surkhaiya's Ghar. Surkhaiya was a normal farmer depending on his cattles for food and most of the thing was done by his daughter. She was a beautiful girl and I knew she was in love with a guy from Narayanghat. I met that guy long back and he seemed a very nice fella. We all went running over there and his house was surrounded by 20-30 people who were talking by thereselves. Me and my granny went inside the house. There I cannot describe what I saw. Her mother was lying on one corner near the chulo beating her heart badly and crying. lied near was Pabiya, Surkhaiya's daughter, on a white katro. She was dead. The girl had committed suicide. Surkhaiya fixed her daughter's marriage to someone else whom she never loved at all. That Narayanghat guy was an intercaste and Surkhaiya had found out about her love with that Narayanghat guy. The guy new nothing about it. My granny went straight to Surkhaiya's wife and hugged her tightly. My goodness me, she was crying very loud. Her daughter was everything to her. They were poor, lived in a house made with straws, the only thing now she can depend on was her two ox, a cow, and two bakhras. That was it. She had nothing left. It was too difficult for me to see all that. I walked outside very slowly, I was very mad too. I wanted to shout at those people outside, "DEKHYO TIMIHARULE, YESTAI HUNCHA". But I also noticed that not all people opposed intercaste. Most of the time in that village called Sheheri, the daughters ran away because of their family opposing their love to intercastes. Pabiya was dead, but left a good lesson to be learnt by everyone, that was, EVERYBODY HAS A RED BLOOD RUNNING THROUGH THEIR VEINS. I walked in despair. |
| bhedo | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 04:41 PM
It's like this. Even if we manage to get rid of all the taboos that promote segregation, people will still opt to marry those who look like themselves. That's just a fact of life. Just take a look at South America, for instance. Light skinned mestizos would rather marry a light skinned mestizo than say, a darkskinned mulatto. Hispanics of European origin would prefer to stay with their own kind. In Brazil, there is virtually no racism , although they do have class differences. It is also true that whites are controlling the economy. Still, things seem to get synchronized somehow. People want to be with their own kind, even if you manage to throw out all restrictions out the window. |
| whine and chij | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 04:56 PM
the original question betrays the societal bias behind it. it's loaded. rather than ask what's "wrong" with it, an objective alternative would be to ask "do you support it?" or "what do you think about it?", for example. better yet, HOW do you support or oppose it? for anyone who's ever been in such a relationship, it's more important what others do vis-a-vis the relationship, not what they say or how they posture on the issue... it's kinda like the nepali guys who tell nepali ketis married to bideshi ketas, "what's wrong with your own kind?" instead, maybe they should ask what they're doing to turn off their "own" women. perhaps those guys really want to marry foreign ketis and therefore (un?)consciously contribute to the nepali babe drain. maybe some kuire might start a mail-order nepali bride service...do you think many ketis would sign up? |
| bhedo | Posted
on 15-Jan-03 05:19 PM
It may be a good thing to marry outside your race in a sense. Check this site out. It's about heterosis in pigs. http://www.dpi.qld.gov.au/pigs/1548.html However, we also know that some inbred groups like Ashkenazi Jews and Parsees are highly intelligent. But inbreeding can result in a whole lot of problems. Marrying someone who isn't genetically that distant from you can result in faster accumulation of genetic load. |
| sweetie | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 08:12 AM
Sad Ending Robert Forst ji, I know I have heard and seen a lot ofpple going through the same.............One time my uncle was in love with a gal from smaller caste than his (that was the thought)...........and he left the house and ran away with her..........and came back after few months. His family then fakai fulai gareyra asked to leave that gal and send home. The girl went home after she was assured that she will be married to him but in a religious way.................but after few months that uncle of mine married another woman..............felt really bad for the gal, she was young, preety and naive..........but noone cared.........everyone was happy to finally get a buhari of same caste..............It's such a risk for a woman to marry intercaste.......incase they couldnot differenciate between LOVE or LUST of the guy's feelings! |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 09:01 AM
Whine and Chij, you are right. The original post and some of the following posts reveal the biases of the posters. (As for mail-order brides, that’s a totally offensive idea. Sure, some women would sign up, but those who sign up would most likely be doing so just like those who “choose” to stand in the streets to make a living do! Badhyata!) People who marry outside their prescribed community marry for many reasons and not all marry because there is a dearth of eligible, suitable bachelors from their own communities or because the local men are turning them off (not that that does not happen). There is such a thing called free will and love. But that is not to say that there are no tradeoffs that a woman might be consciously looking at in marrying someone particular… whether they are of a different caste, race, nationality, city, or whatever. It would be really naïve to think otherwise. Anyhow, I wanted to comment… Sweetie said "smaller caste" and that just irritated me... you mean "lower caste"?! And why is it “lower” or “smaller” anyhow? Because someone else wants to say they are higher or “bigger”, someone wants to hold on to their own privilege and perpetuate the inequality, hoina? Supposedly the caste system was simply about division of labor, so when did this higher lower come about? And by the way when you say “smaller/lower” caste, do you mean someone from an ethnic group? There is some confusion among some about caste and ethnicity. Some Nepali ethnic groups are not from the brahmanical, caste based traditions, yet this “lesser,” “lower” caste shit is imposed on them. I think it is high time those in the “higher castes” start **educating** themselves about others outside their little groups. And intercaste marriages is not the only way to save Nepal. Actually it is a really really bad idea. It totally pollutes the sanctity of marriage! (gosh, that sounds good.) Anyway. Marriages that overstep boundaries of culture, caste, national, and race are frought with their own complexities. If two individuals are committed to the relationship and to each other then the marriages work. Just like any other marriage. From what I have seen in Nepal, intercaste marriages seem to me have two or three motivations: 1. love, 2. defiance against parents/culture/ tradition (e.g. Naipauls’ protagonist’s dad in “Half a Life”, and 3. circumstance (as in the woman is pregnant). Unless love is a factor and unless those two individuals are committed to each other and to being a unit in facing the protests and sabotage of the families and society at large, that marriage will fall apart. |
| Poonte | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 10:22 AM
Yeah! Down with the caste system in whole! It was never NEPALI originally, and should not be! However, I would not go as far as to say that we should encourage intercaste marriages--the idea of forcing people to fall in love with someone from another caste is as loathesome as our older generations'mostly-sucessful attempts to force people to marry someone from the same caste. The encouragment for intercaste marriages should come AFTER they fall in love. |
| ruck | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 10:25 AM
I agree with Poonte.... |
| sweetie | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 11:07 AM
Surya Dai, I donot think any caste is lower or Higher............I was saying what they said at that time................I think everyone has red blood flowing on their body...........and it hurts to everyone if you cut yourself....... I am mixed among all kinds of castes..........Talking about my self I have newar friends, bahun friends, tamang friends, and I love all of them, All of them are equal..............I was just stating what had happened when I was a child and no one cared how I felt at that time...............well! they thought it was low caste..........I didnot and that's why things like that happened....! However, girls need to be very careful if they are doing Intercaste marriage coz it might affect their life tremendiously............if the guy backs up! and that's what happened in that Uncles' case. Guy was just after the girl for Lust! He was okay to get married to someone else and settle his life.....and so moved on! |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 12:16 PM
Yeah. That uncle was a moron. And I am not a Dai! :) Thank you though. I am sure you meant it very nicely. Tara saino nalagayera malai Surya matra bhane huncha! :) |
| vivid | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 12:17 PM
Frost ji, Nawalparasi??? Made me remember all those faces whom I met during my visits. Have seen them meek women metamorphosized into bold ones within the time span of 1 year. Phew!! they were really energetic and dedicated. Poonte ji, No one is encouraging someone to fall in love from another caste ni, but the suggestion to go for it is if he really has fallen for her hoina ra?? Anyway, it depends upon several intrinsic and extrinsic factors but me believes the if there is a will there is always a way, ki kaso?? |
| sweetie | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 12:56 PM
Kina, suryadai, Vai vanau ta? |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 02:03 PM
Yo saino lagaune bani kasto? Can't you deal with someone as an individual? Ani pheri... we are obviously not necessarily always what our names say we are, are we now? :) Sweetie. |
| sweetie | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 02:06 PM
Nepali vahey pachi saino ta lagaunai aaucha ni! Either vai or baini or dai or didi? Anyways Nepali right? so what is the problem.seem like u are disguised female in male name then! Is that so..............? Anyways I am either Didi or baini...........and I am telling u the truth! --Shova |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 02:17 PM
Shova ji: Keep your sainos to your self and use it on people who appreciate it. I have no desire to be your didi or bahini. Don't tell me how Nepalis operate. To each their own. Nepali bhayo bhandai ma saino nai lagauna parcha bhanne chaina. I have my own didis and bhaninis and dais and bhais. They fill my life with joy and that is enough. I am not looking to have some void filled with strangers in cyberspace. If you think I have been disguising the fact that I am female, you might want to pull up some of my old posts and read them. Please don't start something you can't finish. Truth is not a monolith. Your truth obviously differs from mine. Just don't try to shove yours down my throat and I will try not to do the same to you either. :) Peace. |
| czar | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 02:18 PM
Sweety, in not so many words, Surya here is a lady. Hope that helps clarify things you. Cheers ! |
| dirk | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 02:25 PM
And this czar is actually a king.....is it the viii th? :) |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 02:43 PM
Thank you Czar. So nice of you to say that. :) Now does that mean I really have to behave like a lady? darn! |
| sweetie | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 03:24 PM
Well, seems like surya is having a bad day @ work.........well, this thread is not to argue...........to share our ideas on how you feel...........and how you think about our community. One of my friends used to say that if someone is mad at you.......donot take it personally.........just think that "That person is very miserable and is trying to make everyone else MISERABLE.......! Surya , I feel sorry for you to know that u are one of them............and u are trying to give everyone the same by being so rude.......Well, with this email I will let you go.............as u are a miserable person :(! |
| Logical Sense | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 03:32 PM
Shovaji and Suryaji it is interesting to observer that a nice thread started in bringing out lots of good inside all of us is dying because of quick arguments for something as interesting as calling someone didi or bahini. Though Shovaji, calling didi or bahini sounds so Nepali we also need to accept the facts that some people don't like them to be called didi or bahini or dai or bhai. Really we need to learn individual's preferenes, and honor it. These days I have learnt yet another cliche "Though I don't like not to call any Nepali a didi or bahini, but, I Honor her choice". Also, please let me know if Suryaji or Shovaji (Shovaji you siginging your name under Sweetie was accident or on purpose or on disguise?) don't like a 'ji' behind their nam? My 2 cents, please don't get it otherwise. So, back to the intercast marriage.... |
| Logical Sense | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 03:35 PM
Anyone of you ahve declared intercaste marriage in this Virtual site, besides NK? BTW does this intercaste also covers interracial marriage? |
| whine and chij | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 03:58 PM
sweetie more like sourie...must be a miserable person trying to infect everyone else. lighten up and go appreciate the sun, hun. enjoie! |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 03:59 PM
Sweetie: thank you for your judgement! I will hold it dear to my heart that such an enlightened and mature person such as yourself *know* what ails my petty soul! Without the likes of you, I would feel terrible for my occasional (ahem! :) ) self-righteousness and my desire not to suffer fools! I am glad that feeling sorry for me might make you feel better! |
| bhedo | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 04:20 PM
Say what, Surya? You a gal? I thought you're a guy. |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 04:25 PM
hehe bhedo. slow as ever you are. |
| bhedo | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 04:31 PM
What do you expect when you have a manly pseudonym? In any case, I don't visit this site often, so naturally I won't be knowing everyone's sex in here. But please don't taunt me. I am pretty short tempered. |
| surya | Posted
on 16-Jan-03 04:35 PM
:) |
| whine and chij | Posted
on 17-Jan-03 09:47 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=834&ncid=731&e=10&u=/nm/20030117/wl_india_nm/india_100903 ok, so it's an interclass, not intercaste, marriage. |
| forget-me-not | Posted
on 17-Jan-03 03:50 PM
what ever... Intercaste marriage works in some cases but doesnot work in other....How one feels is diferent ..some take it positively and some negatively.. atking about inter racial marraige..I heard lot of Asians are willing to marry americans for so called "hariyo kagaj" re......maile ta suneko kas manchhe bheteko chaina... |
| Himali_yatri | Posted
on 18-Jan-03 11:15 AM
As always Nepalese are all the time full of echo, they say they don't need respect but each and every moment you can see their desire for resepect,even for being individual, respect for being smart, for being professional, for being rich higher caste, respect for being understanding, respect for being generous kind , helpful, ......................... respect for being individual, respect for being social.If someone call you dai or didi, you have to give big lecture about indivitual identity, then if you ask someone to call you by name, then she not only give big lecture about nepalese culture, will also ready to call someone miserable( to one whom she just called Didi or dai). Intercaste marriage?what is intercaste?There doesn't exist caste, then how come there is intercaste?Caste is derived from your profession, thats all. Hey everyone! try catch new century, forget the caste and forget the intercaste. |